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Has Honda pushed the limits too far?

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#61 ·
Fred H. said:
I really wanted to replace my wife's 2001 V6 Accord with a new one. It's unfortunate Honda hasn't addressed this head gasket issue. Even the non-turbo 2.0 liter engines have had some failures of it.
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Not sure I'm helping or just being a contrarian, but -

Copy and paste from Google AI Overview:

While there are reports of head gasket failures in some Honda 1.5-liter and 2.0-liter turbo engines, there's no widespread evidence of head gasket failures in non-turbo 2.0L Honda engines. Honda's 2.0L non-turbo engines, like those found in the Accord, Civic, and CR-V, are generally considered reliable.
 
#62 ·
Crabballs said:
Have you guys considered it might be a piston ring issue. My coworker's normally asperated Accura was using 1 quart of oil per 1,000 miles. Dealer changed rings and all good. I know it is a different but similar problem
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2009 CRV with 120k and clogged/carboned oil rings in pistons. Common issue. Tried a Berryman B12 soak, gallon of turpentine in the tank, etc. Valvoline Restore and Protect oil did the trick. Went from using a qt of oil every 1200-1500 miles to maybe a qt in 5-6k miles.
 
#63 ·
Nodaker said:
Diesel engines have been turbo for many years with few problems. Why do turbo gas engines not work as well?
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True, but even diesel engines are having reliability issues. I drove a 220D in the 70's and a VW Dasher diesel through the 80's and 90s and the only issue I had was a injector pump leak after they removed sulfur from diesel fuel. Both cars were N/A. But my nephews 2022 Ram 2500 suffered catastrophic engine failure with less than 50,000 miles.
 
#65 ·
T-88 said:
If you watch The Oil Geek on YouTube (the host claims to be a certified engine oil specialist and says he was the oil specialist for Joe Gibbs Racing in NASCAR), he explains the Chevy 6.2 liter engine failures WAS NOT DUE TO THE RECOMMENDED OIL VISCOSITY; the failures were due to manufactured parts not being machined to the required specifications. If the engines built within the production time frame of the problem engines are inspected and are deemed “ok”, then GM apparently recommends a heavier viscosity oil “just in case.” As I recall from the video, GM did not recommend an oil viscosity change to the “normal” 6.2 liter engines that were built to spec.

Bottom line: 6.2 liter engine failures were due to manufacturing faults, not recommended oil viscosity.

Tim
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Precisely. There were thousands of crankshafts manufactured by Questum Macimex that did not meet surface finish specifications. Connecting rods manufactured by American Axle And Manufacturing also did not meet specifications because of sediment contamination.
 
#66 ·
What are folks considering a "small" displacement engine? Would you consider an inline-6 cylinder 3.0L turbo with hybrid assist small for a car engine? That's what I have in a 2025 MB and I'm hoping to get at least 200K miles over the next 15 years. Oil is changed every 4-5K.
 
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Discussion starter · #67 · (Edited)
Honda is putting a 1.5 liter turbo engine in 4 door Accords which is a 3,500 lb car. I call that a small engine for this size of a car. The larger engine option with the hybrid is a 2.0.

My 2001 Accord has a 3.0 liter V6 and it makes about the same horsepower as the newer 1.5 turbo, but is a much larger/stronger engine with a great reliability record. I've just decided I'm going to freshen it up and see if it can make 300K miles instead of replacing it. I already started on it today, and I'm replacing a leaking radiator, fixing a couple oil leaks, adjusting the valves, and replacing the standard tune-up stuff on it. I've already checked some of the valves, and at 220K miles they are still at center spec. I think I last checked them around 110K miles.

Maybe when Honda gets around to fixing their current head gasket problems I'll think about replacing it. When I buy a Honda, I expect it to last at least 200K miles. I don't think any of the current models are able to do that.

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#68 ·
Fred H. said:
Honda is putting a 1.5 liter turbo engine in 4 door Accords which is a 3,500 lb car. I call that a small engine for this size of a car. The larger engine option with the hybrid is a 2.0.

My 2001 Accord has a 3.0 liter V6 and it makes about the same horsepower as the newer 1.5 turbo, but is a much larger/stronger engine with a great reliability record. I've just decided I'm going to freshen it up and see if it can make 300K miles instead of replacing it. I already started on it today, and I'm replacing a leaking radiator, fixing a couple oil leaks, adjusting the valves, and replacing the standard tune-up stuff on it. I've already checked some of the valves, and at 220K miles they are still at center spec. I think I last checked them around 110K miles.

Maybe when Honda gets around to fixing their current head gasket problems I'll think about replacing it.

View attachment 492819
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That was before all the weight, fuel mileage and emission regulations started hitting the fan.
 
Discussion starter · #69 · (Edited)
cihilb said:
That was before all the weight, fuel mileage and emission regulations started hitting the fan.
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It seems to me like false economics to force all these high mileage requirements on manufactures when it results in cars that end up in the junk yard 10 years early because they are no longer reliable.

People seem to forget about the environmental costs associated with manufacturing a new car, and the effect of them rotting in junk yards. How much energy and resources are consumed in making a new car? If that same car only last 1/3 as long as it used to, but gets better gas mileage, are you really making progress, or are you actually going backwards?

Not to mention the economic impact it has on a society that now has to buy a new car every 4 years because they don't last anymore than that.

I could easily make the argument that by fixing up my old 2001 Honda that only gets about 25mpg and continuing to drive it, that I'm having less of an impact on the environment than someone that buys a brand new one that gets 45mpg but doesn't even last 5 years.
 
#71 ·
Jack2 said:
In the fire department where I served the diesel engine turbos did have failures, but probably due to limited funding to perform maintenance, such as oil changes.
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Diesels and turbos often don't fare well to startup and immediate heavy load such as what might get done to these vehicles on emergency call.
 
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#72 ·
Fred H. said:
It seems to me like false economics to force all these high mileage requirements on manufactures when it results in cars that end up in the junk yard 10 years early because they are no longer reliable.

People seem to forget about the environmental costs associated with manufacturing a new car, and the effect of them rotting in junk yards. How much energy and resources are consumed in making a new car? If that same car only last 1/3 as long as it used to, but gets better gas mileage, are you really making progress, or are you actually going backwards?

Not to mention the economic impact it has on a society that now has to buy a new car every 4 years because they don't last anymore than that.

I could easily make the argument that by fixing up my old 2001 Honda that only gets about 25mpg and continuing to drive it, that I'm having less of an impact on the environment than someone that buys a brand new one that gets 45mpg but doesn't even last 5 years.
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The government doesn't think that far ahead...
 
#74 ·
Fred H. said:
All this talk about reliability has me wondering if maybe leasing is a better option. I've never leased a vehicle, but in light of the early demise of them, maybe that's a better option.
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A Toyota Camry is a great choice for a sedan. Only available in Hybrid now I believe though. But Toyota does a fantastic job with the Hybrids. 50+ mpg is a nice bonus.
My wife and I had a Toyota Crown Hybrid for a while. It was getting well over 50 mpg around town. Either of these models is a great choice for a sedan if you are looking for a reliable long lasting vehicle.
 
#75 · (Edited)
techdude2000 said:
My Mazda engines are doing fine. There was an issue with one of them about 6 years ago and Mazda redesigned the head and got rid of that issue before I bought one. Zoom, Zoom
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Maybe so, but you'll never beat the reliability of the old tried and true Amish buggy. After 150+ years of documented use in the harshest conditions and demands there are no known cases of a blown head gasket. And compared to the Mazda that gives nothing back to the owner, the Amish buggy produces fertilizer for the farm, combustible gas (methane) to power the headlamps using the optional direct injection hookup from the power plant. And the engine is 100% recyclable when worn out and can feed a family of twelve for a month by simply putting it down and butchering it. When was the last time you had melt in your mouth prime rib from a Mazda?
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#76 ·
I've never considered Plug-in Hybrid as an option, probably because I'm old and set in my ways. But it seems that hybrids may be the future the market will pursue. Toyota and Honda seem to be in the fore front of the tech.

We've all witnessed the EV mandates that have tanked, with some car makers backing away.

Not having much knowledge of hybrids, outside of my interest in F1 racing where Honda has proved it's metal, I did a search and found this article. Written by a money guy, not a car guy, it's very interesting and worth a read if your considering hybrid.

www.moneysmartguides.com

Do Hybrid Cars Save You Money? The Answer Will Surprise You

Learn why that hybrid might be costing you more money than you planned.
www.moneysmartguides.com www.moneysmartguides.com
 
#77 ·
Ive been driving turbo cars for the last 10 years and so far no issues at all with the turbo or engine...one was a 2014 Chevy Cruise with a 2000 cc turbo diesel and not one issue with 124k miles...the other is my 2024 Kia Forte GT with a 1600cc turbo engine and so far it runs perfectly and Ive had zero issues and not even any adjustments under warranty.
I rarely even spin the engines up with my cars, but when I do the 1.6 turbo really moves for what it is. The 1.6 turbo gas engine makes 201hp and the 2.0 diesel made 150hp. The 2.0 turbo diesel made tons of torque, but the 1.6 turbo gas engine makes pretty good torque too for a smaller car. The 1.6 engine does turn a few more rpms while cruising than the 2.0 engine but its hardly noticeable really, no more revs than the Gold Wings 1800cc engine. I change the oil a bit sooner with the turbo engines.

The 2.0 turbo diesel engine had by far the best fuel mileage on the highway seeing low 50's, but with normal driving around home that mileage dropped to just average for a smaller car.

The diesel engine was a joy to drive with 269 ftlbs of torque. The main reason I got away from the turbo diesel engine is because of the emissions system and that DEF system..which because of the EPA mandates is the weak link with the diesel engines. One fault code with that DEF system puts the diesel vehicle in shut down mode.
 
#78 ·
Yes, I agree. Durability seems to be out the window some what with Honda cars. Daily driver we have is a 2013 Civic with 150k plus miles on it. Besides the paint falling off from sun burn and window wiper seals gone, the car operates great.

Smaller engines with turbos is a bad idea in my book.. Wife wants a newer - ish car , but I do not trust the durability or CVT type transmissions
 
#80 ·
Murphy said:
Old saying goes " There's no replacement for cubic displacement". Turbos blow in time. And when they do the engine usually does too, as it sucks the oil from the crankcase.
Trying to make small engines they are not intended to.
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You’re right, Murphy. There is no replacement for displacement. :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

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