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Discussion Starter #1
If one doesn't want this done, are dealers under any obligation if bike is in for other service?
 

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Why would you not want it done, its free and when they run your vin number it will show where the update has been done or not.
 

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Of coarse I'm not a dealer; therefore, I do not have a Honda dealer contract in front of me, but the answer is yes. However, I have worked for car dealers, and "dealer agreement" between a car dealer and the car manufacture is gonna be similar.

Basically to become a dealer certain agreements are made in writing between the owner of the dealer and Honda. For example ...
- the dealer will do Honda's warrantee work
- all Honda parts are sold through Honda's dealer network
- if a Honda product comes in, completing a safety recall is required

When it comes to safety recalls, the reason they must be done is because Honda is trying to lesson their liability. Possibly not only to save a riders life, but possibly other motorists too !!!

I've not had SB-23 done on my 2007. It now has 170,000 miles on it. Because I've changed its brake fluid every 12k, per Honda's Maintenance Schedule, and by what Honda says really caused rear brake lock up (owners' maintenance neglect) I would expect to never have a problem with my rear brakes locking up. However, if I were to go to a dealer for repair, SB-23 would get done.
 

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Why would you not want it done, its free and when they run your vin number it will show where the update has been done or not.



My brakes have not worked as well ever since they did the recall. If you go through the posts here you'll find it's not an uncommon complaint.
 

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My brakes have not worked as well ever since they did the recall. If you go through the posts here you'll find it's not an uncommon complaint.
Can you share what you mean ???
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
My brakes have not worked as well ever since they did the recall. If you go through the posts here you'll find it's not an uncommon complaint.
That is my concern. Several occasions that I am aware of that air was introduced into the system that the dealership was unable or unwilling to do what was necessary to resolve. (think Rocky bleed). I have a friend with that problem as we speak and the dealership that did his brake recall is the one I am considering for unrelated work.

The unrelated work I need is replacement of front tire. I may just remove the wheel and take that in to avoid the brake recall issue. Dealer is 70 miles away.
 

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Was there not 2 brake recalls?

The second one being more involved, because the first didn't make enough changes?

(or maybe a service bulletin to be done on bikes if problems were presented; followed later by the safety recall?)


Anyway, we had the last recall done on two 1832's.

Both operated flawlessly after for many 1000's of miles.

...except for me needing to correct the adjustment of the foot pedal switches so the cruise would stay on. (simple task if needed, and lots did)
 

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Had the brake recall done and got the rear brake shutter before I got home. Never did it before.



Barney
The rear brake shutter is elusive, and for most, if not all, it is never reproducible on any consistent basis. Per Honda, the only repair for it is to properly operate the m/c and use both brakes. Some have done various things thinking, and also reporting back here that they have corrected it, only to find out a summer or two later that it is still there.
 

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Can you share what you mean ???

Never had the shutter till after they did the recall. Had the recall work done in March of '18, the shutter shows up when the ambient temp in above 90, So it didn't show up till July. Took it back to them. They claimed they never heard of an brake shutter on the wing associated with the recall. They also claimed they did everything according to the book and I'm not using the breaks properly. I have tried every method on this sight with to no avail to correct the "Benefits" of the recall.
 

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I had a few issues (squishy pedal) after the recall of the rear master cylinder. I just flushed the fluid and bled the brakes. All is well now.
 

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I had this recall done with good results with the exception of the tech dropping my engine side cover scratching it up and then trying paint it with a gloss black paint instead of the matte paint that I used. They also lost the rubber grommet and claimed it wasn't there to begin with. They did give me another cover and grommet when push came to shove....
 

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...
by what Honda says really caused rear brake lock up (owners' maintenance neglect) ...
Could you provide the documentation where Honda said that?

And if that was truly the cause what did Honda do to alleviate owner neglect as the issue? I understood that the fix is a new caliper with an enlarged, (return?), port and copious flushing.
 

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Could you provide the documentation where Honda said that?

And if that was truly the cause what did Honda do to alleviate owner neglect as the issue? I understood that the fix is a new caliper with an enlarged, (return?), port and copious flushing.
Certainly ... you will find that info on SB-23.

"Honda is launching a Safety Recall of 2012- 2015 GL1800/A and 2013-2015 GL1800B/BD motorcycles, and is implementing a recall remedy for 2001-2010 and 2012 GL1800/A motorcycles already subject to Safety Recall “JG6”. Honda has determined that under con- ditions where the brake fluid is subject to pro- longed aging due to a lack of maintenance (i.e., the brake fluid is not replaced for a long period of time despite the published mainte- nance schedule of replacement every 12,000 miles or two years, whichever comes first), deposits may form within the brake fluid. If sufficient deposits are formed, they can result in a malfunction of the secondary master cyl- inder, which may cause the rear brake to drag.
A redesigned secondary master cylinder with new internal valving is now available to correct this condition; in addition, Honda has updated its brake fluid replacement service procedure to better ensure that all old brake fluid is removed from the system."
 

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Thanks for providing that Greg, I must have skipped over that part.
I shoulda looked up the related SB's myself.

I am pleased to see in the next couple paragraphs after what you quoted that Honda didn't try to pretend it wasn't a defect.
During the month of November 2015, Honda will mail a letter to all owners of affected motorcycles informing them that their motorcycle is being recalled for a safety related defect, or that a remedy is now available for the previously identified safety defect. The customer will be made aware of the safety risk and advised to have a Honda dealer replace the secondary master cylinder.
i am not contending that not following the recommended replacement schedule of the brake fluid doesn't contribute to this problem but will make the counter argument that I don't recall ever flushing the brake fluid in any of my cars, trucks, vans or other motorcycles. I have never had even one caliper lock up on me. And I have always done my own brake pad replacement,(shoes too but drum brakes don't have calipers so don't fit in this discussion), and brake bleeding.

My guess is that placing the blame on the owners maintenance schedule adherence is just another way for Honda to avoid liability. I don't blame them, just don't believe them.
 

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Thanks for providing that Greg, I must have skipped over that part.
I shoulda looked up the related SB's myself.

I am pleased to see in the next couple paragraphs after what you quoted that Honda didn't try to pretend it wasn't a defect.


i am not contending that not following the recommended replacement schedule of the brake fluid doesn't contribute to this problem but will make the counter argument that I don't recall ever flushing the brake fluid in any of my cars, trucks, vans or other motorcycles. I have never had even one caliper lock up on me. And I have always done my own brake pad replacement,(shoes too but drum brakes don't have calipers so don't fit in this discussion), and brake bleeding.

My guess is that placing the blame on the owners maintenance schedule adherence is just another way for Honda to avoid liability. I don't blame them, just don't believe them.
Regarding never bleeding other vehicles ... with my doctor, my argument is similar ... why were my parents not over weight, and had no overweight health related problems, but I do. Quit telling me I need to change my diet and exercise too. However, even though my parents were not over weight, one could easily argue that it they too ate better and exercised, they would have lived a longer life. As with poor diet and exercise, poor maintenance puts various systems at a higher risk of failure.

As for my Wing with a 175k on the ODM, I never had a rear brake lock up issue, and have never had Honda complete SB-23. The reason, according to the recall, I conclude that if a Wing was maintained correctly, SB-23 is not needed.

Possibly more import than anything is looking at a broader picture, and of course this will not apply to all, but look at all the other issues poor brake fluid maintenance has cause. Here is what comes to my mind.
  • rear brake lock up
  • uneven brake pad wear
  • harsh ride from ADV not able to operate properly
  • leaking ADVs
  • leaking and failing proportioning valves
 
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