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Discussion Starter #1
I been reading about mishaps on our Goldwings that have been showing up here this summer, and I can't help but wonder
how all you riders feel about what contributes to these mishaps, and how we all can be better/safer riders, and can learn from the writings
of those unfortunate that can reflect back and still lucky enough write about them.

Here's a couple true and false questions I came up with recently to see how they apply to your type of riding style, or how you protect
yourself for a ride local or over the state line.

I don't know if there has been a study or proof that would contribute to why these mishaps occur, but, I would like to hear
your reason/opinions on if they have any effect on mishaps, if any. Some are just common sense but anyone has their own opinion on why and what if.

Like they taught us in cycle school, there is no such thing as a accident, only mishaps, because accidents can't be avoided.

Let's hear what you think..........


#1..... Wearing full gear, helmet, reinforced jacket, pants, cycle boots makes your feel safer to the point were you
ride faster and take chances?

True or False


#2..... Riding with a group, compared to riding alone, makes you ride faster, and take more chances to keep up with the others?

True or False


#3..... Riding two-up makers you ride safer and take less chances?

True or False



#4..... Loud pipes has little to do with being seen or safe?

True or False


#5..... Know the limits of your ride with range (parking lot) practice increases your chances for survival in a panic situation?

True or False



#6..... Pulling a loader trailer can hinder your control in panic stop?

True or False


#7...... Electronics, GPS, radar detectors, I-pods, cell phone, should be used only when stopped, and are riding distractions?

True or False


#8...... Road conditions and weather is a big factor on safety?

True or False


#9...... Airbags and ABS on new cycles should be standard equipment?

True or False
 

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#1..... Wearing full gear, helmet, reinforced jacket, pants, cycle boots makes your feel saver to the point were you ride faster and take chances?

I think this is really a chicken or the egg kind of question. I believe that the safer a rider you are, then the more gear you will wear. I also think that safer riders know their limits and ride within them. That said, I also think that safer riders will push their limits in small increments to improve their skills. After considering this, I think the answer to your question is False, but with some caveats.


#2..... Riding with a group, compared to riding alone, makes you ride faster, and take more chances to keep up with the others?

If a rider is secure in his or her skills, knows that the group doesn't let you out of your obligation to "ride your own ride," and has a strong enough character not to fall into the group-think trap, then group riding or solo riding makes no difference. If any of the things listed isn't present, then you can start to make bad decisions and you won't be as safe a rider as you would be riding alone.

#3..... Riding two-up makers you ride safer and take less chances?

True... When carrying a passenger, you are now responsible for precious cargo. Of course, there are those that want to show off their skills, but two-up is no time to be pushing your limits.

#4..... Loud pipes has little to do with being seen or safe?

True... Reference the Harley-Bashing forum.

#5..... Know the limits of your ride with range (parking lot) practice increases your chances for survival in a panic situation?

True and False

Any riding practice is good, but don't rely on the ERC card in your back pocket to keep you out of high speed trouble. Find a local track that will let you run your wing and practice high speed things, or take a class (www.streetmasters.info or similar).

#6..... Pulling a loader trailer can hinder your control in panic stop?

True... You need to adjust your speed and stopping distance. Like riding itself, towing a trailer is a risk that can be mitigated.

#7...... Electronics, GPS, radar detectors, I-pods, cell phone, should be used only when stopped, and are riding distractions?

False - All of these things can lower your attention levels, but again, by using them responsibly, they can also be a great boon to the rider.


#8...... Road conditions and weather is a big factor on safety?

True - This should be self-evident, but if you're on a road or in conditions that you are unfamiliar with, you should adjust your riding accordingly, to the point of pulling over and stopping for awhile.

#9...... Airbags and ABS on new cycles should be standard equipment?

True for ABS, dunno for Airbags

The ABS technology has advanced enough and has proven itself time and again, that I think it should be included on all bikes (at least as an option). I haven't decided if airbags are useful or are just a marketing gimmick. I guess we'll have to wait for the statistics to prove that one out.
 

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1.F. I always wear them, does not effect my driving.
2.T. I don't fall into that trap, a lot of riders do, some of my best friends. This is a real issue between us. I just meet them at our destination. I have witnessed accidents due to this.
3.T. I think you are more cautious, you are responsible.
4.F. By the time you here the pipes the dange has passed.
5.T. Practice does help.
6.T. Pulling a trailer reduces maneuvering and increases braking distance.
7.F. If you scan and make adjustments to these devices at the proper times.
8.T. Always affects other drivers, visibility, stability etc.
9.T. ABS is a no brainier, I believe the air bag will prove to be the same. Only time will tell.
 

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I know I am not a Wing rider, but I love all kinds/types of bikes. From my 39 years of riding experience, here are my answers:
F,T,T,F,F,T,T,T,F
By the way, this is a very interesting poll...
 

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T T T T T T T T F
JDSWING said:
1.F. I always wear them, does not effect my driving.
Have you ever ridden without them for any period of time to compare? :roll:

Do this test: After riding the motocycle continuously for months on end ride a cage for a week w/o being on the cycle, do you ride (cage or cycle) safer/aware or more dangerously at the end of the week? It may be telling of my character, but I sure loose my motorcycle sixth sense quickly when in a cage; and when I put my protective gear on when cycling, I drive more aggressively. Sometimes I can't tell the difference until I notice that I hit the stop at the end of the throttle by just adding the helmet ... 28 years of riding, I can't shake it.
 

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1. F
2. F
3. F
4. T
5. T
6. T
7. T (except for GPS which is used as a speedometer)
8. T
9. F (with exception of ABS - T)

Many of the questions (especially the first three) presuppose that an individual's riding style changes because of what they wear or whether or not a passenger is on board. I would like to think that my style doesn't change because I know my limits. If riding in a group makes me feel uncomfortable, I will drop out of the group or get in the lead (lol). For example, I've always considered myself to be a slightly aggressive rider, but certainly nowhere near the competence of Yellow Wolf or some of the others who are really quick.

I guess it goes back to the old mantra, "ride your own ride!"

Mesquite Bob
 

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motorcycle error

It is my opinion that the overwhelming majority of motorcycle accidents are the result of driver error. Riding too fast for conditions will put you sliding on the pavement faster than anything.
 

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1. F
2. F
3. F
4. T
5. T
6. T
7. F Distractions yeah, but so is the speedo, other gauges and radios
8. T
9. F
 

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1-F
2-F
3-T
4-T
5-T
6-F
7-T
8-T
9-T
 

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1-F
2-F
3-T
4-T
5-T
6.T
7-F
8-T
9-T
 

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F
T
T
T
T
T - so it would seem
F
T
ABS - yes
Air Bag - don't know


I, too, have wondered about what seems like a high incidence of crashes reported on this forum this year. Safety Guru Harry Hurt has said that the three most important things to avoiding a crash is learning to brake, learning to brake and learning to brake. He makes his point. The Wing, at least the ABS model, stops quite well. So I'm thinking braking isn't the primary problem.

Then it occurs to me that the Wing begs ... nearly demands ... to be ridden aggressively. Yeah, I know it only goes as fast as you twist the throttle. But I often find myself twisting the throttle just a bit more than I probably should. It's fun. But things also happen faster, both from the rider's perspective and someone in a car looking at the bike ... from a crossroad, for example.

So, I wonder, if because the Wing is so ridable, some of us are getting into trouble that we wouldn't necessarily have on a lesser bike?
 

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I added a couple at the end.

#1..... Wearing full gear, helmet, reinforced jacket, pants, cycle boots makes your feel safer to the point were you ride faster and take chances?

No, not me.

#2..... Riding with a group, compared to riding alone, makes you ride faster, and take more chances to keep up with the others?

No, not me.

#3..... Riding two-up makers you ride safer and take less chances?

No, not me.

#4..... Loud pipes has little to do with being seen or safe?

True., But, on a sportbike it’s just plain kewl.

#5..... Know the limits of your ride with range (parking lot) practice increases your chances for survival in a panic situation?

True.

#6..... Pulling a loader trailer can hinder your control in panic stop?

True.

#7...... Electronics, GPS, radar detectors, I-pods, cell phone, should be used only when stopped, and are riding distractions?

True.

#8...... Road conditions and weather is a big factor on safety?

True.

#9...... Airbags and ABS on new cycles should be standard equipment?

True.

#10...... Driving drunk is dangerous?

True.

#11...... Hayabuglys are ugly?

True.

#12...... Arai has crappy customer service?

So very true.

#13...... Black Wings are the best.

Definitely true.
 

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#1..... Wearing full gear, helmet, reinforced jacket, pants, cycle boots makes your feel safer to the point were you
ride faster and take chances?
False - I find the opposite to be true. I ride with very little gear - normally t-shirt without helmet. I find when I get all geared up the safety-Nazi hidden deeeeep within comes out.

#2..... Riding with a group, compared to riding alone, makes you ride faster, and take more chances to keep up with the others?
False - I ride slower with a group because I haven't found a group that will keep up with me.

#3..... Riding two-up makers you ride safer and take less chances?
True - No longer just me and we all know it is all about me.

#4..... Loud pipes has little to do with being seen or safe?
True - Unless you are referring to the "Hey look at me!" aspect of loud annoying pipes.

#5..... Know the limits of your ride with range (parking lot) practice increases your chances for survival in a panic situation?
Dunno - never been in a panic situation in a parking lot. True - any repetition of good riding habits increase your chances of doing the right thing without thinking

#6..... Pulling a loader trailer can hinder your control in panic stop?
True - duh

#7...... Electronics, GPS, radar detectors, I-pods, cell phone, should be used only when stopped, and are riding distractions?
Would you really need a radar detector when stopped?

#8...... Road conditions and weather is a big factor on safety?
True

#9...... Airbags and ABS on new cycles should be standard equipment?
True for ABS (and no I don't have it) False at this time for airbags.
 
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Discussion Starter #17
papa benny said:
There is no such thing as an accident or a mishap.......they are all CRASHES!!!!
Yup your right, and another term they use in class is "Occurence"
 

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1 - F
2 - F
3 - F
4 - T
5 - T
6 - T
7 - T
Electronic devices are a distraction, but they can be used if you are carefull.
8 - T
9 - T
Airbags and ABS are examples of technologies that will, in some cases, save lives. ABS is a proven technology already, airbags will eventually be proven when someone survives a "mishap". Anybody want to volunteer to be the test dummy for the bike without the airbag?
 

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papa benny said:
There is no such thing as an accident or a mishap.......they are all CRASHES!!!!
Thats one of the most anal things I have been hearing come from the "Holier (and better) than thou" safety community. Here is the definition of the word "accident":

accident - Pronunciation[ak-si-duhnt] – noun
1. an undesirable or unfortunate happening that occurs unintentionally and usually results in harm, injury, damage, or loss; casualty; mishap: automobile accidents.


In all the motorcycle accident investigations I've been involved, not once did the rider state "I intentionally ran into that car/tree/curb" or "My, that was rather fortuitous!" This BS with semantics is why a lot of folks run from safety instructors instead of listen to them.

Now, shall we argue whether we are motorcyclists or bikers?

okay... I'm better now that I got that off my chest... I'll take a nap now.... my meds should be kicking in any second....
 

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I gotta agree with Dorian_Blue. When I took my ERC the instructor started off with there are no accidents BS and I quickly (and I thought silently) smirked/sneered/chuckled. He asked me to share my thoughts and I told him as an poor misguided angry youth I had 2 "on purposes" in my car so I know the difference. And as Buddy Ryan used to say "I'm feeling much better now..."
 
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