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The throttle maps are significantly de-tuned through out the band in tour mode, I've seen all the maps and compared them. This is the way Honda engineered it. The lower gears are even more detuned.

The reflash is designed to return much of the lost power in Tour mode. This enables you to more easily overtake a vehicle without having to first change modes, you just twist and go. Personally, I like the feel much better of Tour Mode after the reflash, and no longer feel like I need to change to sport mode all the time. I'm able to just leave the bike in Tour mode a lot more of the time. Tour mode is a lot more friendly around town and in traffic and just feels like it fits the bike better. If I really want to play on a twisty road, I'll use Sport mode, but most of the time now I just leave it in Tour.
Thanks, Fred! Great input!
Clay
 

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In the normal tour mode, you can't get 100% throttle. Max throttle only gives you about 80% at best.

The reflash improves both low end throttle response rates of the tour mode and allows you to have max throttle in any gear when in tour. This can be important for overtaking vehicles, because when you turn the throttle wide open, you really will get all available horsepower that the bike has.
ok, hold on just a second. I understand what you're saying, but I want to confirm that you have hard evidence to back this up, as I am having a hard time believing it. So when the motorcycle magazines (back when there were actual magazines) tested this bike, and did dyno testing of horsepower/torque, you're telling me they had to be switching to Sport mode every time to get full power? I don't remember them saying they did this, and it seems unlikely that Honda would design and produce a bike that was handicapped like that out of the factory. As hard as it is to create a powerful, compact, efficient powerplant they just left it at 80% and though, well, the customer won't care or will figure it out? With all due despect, this seems hard to believe for me.

I've always been told (thought, assumed, known?) that different throttle mappings, available now on many, many different bikes, only change the slope of the throttle opening curve, but they that specifically do NOT change the total amount of throttle (or power) available at full twist. Except of course for things like rain mode where the whole goal is reduced torque to the rear wheel.

If this is wrong, and my new bike is "crippled" in the default mode that my bike came with (and changes to with every start) then I want to speak with a manager b/c I'm not happy!
 

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I think Fred has it right. I had a VFR1200F before and here in Belgium it was official détuned to 100 Hp only by ECU and throttle opening by ride by wire. The 100 Hp was only needed for tax regulations in Belgium. 100 Hp was 50 € registration full power (172 Hp) was 2500 € registration. I send my ECU to Gulh(2013) and he took all limiters off so I had a full power. Also here he told me the bike was limited in 1,2,3 and 4 gear. Limited in 5 and 6 gear by throttle opening. So max speed of the bike was arround 220 Km/h after the flash it was 270 Km/h. I was very pleased by the flash. We could do it by Honda and they replaced the completed ECU by another one price 1200 €.
 

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MCaddict; I feel for ya about your unhappiness. The fact that your bike is, in your wording, crippled is obvious if you have tried a top speed run. It is stubborn to accel approaching triple MPH digits and more and more stubborn as it approaches the limited speed of 112 or so. And, its not just Hona..............

prs
 

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ok, hold on just a second. I understand what you're saying, but I want to confirm that you have hard evidence to back this up
Yes, I have the throttle maps, and no, I'm not going to post them. They are both gear and rpm dependent. They are heavily neutered in Tour Mode. Just as an example, if you twist the throttle wide open in 3rd or 4th gear at 3500 RPM, you only get about 75%-80% of available throttle. In Sport mode you get all 100%.
 

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Meh. I still get plenty of response in Tour mode. Even 2-up. But, it is good to know a < $400 "fix" is available if I ever decide to get it.
 

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yea i feel like the power and response is perfect in tour mode around town. and i've never touched full throttle yet, just don't ever feel the need to. so for me it's mostly a moot point i guess, but i still don't like not being able to access all the power the bike can produce. in some ways i miss the "good old days" of butterflys and carbs...
 

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Thanks Fred... Same deal on my 2006 GM gas truck I bought new. I asked a friend that messes a lot with EFI controls on cars. I told him my truck at 2500 RPM and up , it feels like the engine is coming up on the power curve of the camshaft or a 2 stroke engine gettin up on the "pipes" ... His response was : Yep the programming is slowly giving you about 60- 70% throttle till the engine reaches certain RPM ranges.
 

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If I could get better gas mileage out of the Econ Mode, I would do a reflash.
I pass cagers on Econ Mode like a Cheeta racing a one month old baby. I don't see what is the need to get more power to pass cars. I don't even understand the need for a Sports Mode since this bike don't even lean very much--and boy! did I find that out the hard way.

Perhaps a Traxxion Suspension might make it a bit better at providing the suspension compression necessary to lean a bit more, but them engine guards catching is always a threat to lifting the tires off the ground on a mean lean...

Don't mind me, I had the same incomprehensible state of mind when talking to hot-rodders on the K16 forum.
These bike don't do well in aggressive riding, they are too big, too heavy, not maneuverable enough to ride overlyhard.

I don't see why some of you folks don't just used a crotch to satisfy the 'need-for-speed'.

Its a Wing: a touring tub on two wheels. That's the design. Meant for comfort and the long haul. Not for speeding.

I am just conversing ok!, I ain't telling no one what to do. Just sharing my own thoughts on the subject cause I crashed my '19 already trying to ride it like I used to ride my RT.
 

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One must know the limits of the bike and their own to have a safe and enjoyable experience! Until those come into harmony incident(s) will come about some not so bad some very bad!:cool:
 

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I did a reflash (Graves) of my XSR900, but that was because the EURO4 leaned out the bike too much at low RPMs. the new map enriched the lower RPMs and the bike runs much better. Not sure if this bike runs lean, but a reflash can help with that too.
 

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Does anyone know if they are still open, during the economy shutdown? i wanted to send mine to get done. I tried phone number, but messages were full.
 

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Does anyone know if they are still open, during the economy shutdown? i wanted to send mine to get done. I tried phone number, but messages were full.
If you have FaceBook go to his page....I chatted with him on messenger last evening. Leave him a message and Dan will get with you.
 

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Does anyone know if they are still open, during the economy shutdown? i wanted to send mine to get done. I tried phone number, but messages were full.
Read a post by Don Guhl on another forum. Paraphrasing what he wrote, he goes into work and does some flashing, but his employees are at home. So, it will take longer to get things done.
 

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Read a post by Don Guhl on another forum. Paraphrasing what he wrote, he goes into work and does some flashing, but his employees are at home. So, it will take longer to get things done.
Thanks. I sent my seat off to Russell, so I have a few weeks to get this done. I'll keep calling and have wife look on facebook.
 

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Does Guhl mark the ecm after a reflash, maybe with a sticker or marker? I purchased a very well appointed 2018 and I wouldn’t be surprised if the original owner didn’t have this done, although the bike behaves like most describe before the reflash. I was just wondering if I took the ecm out if I could tell whether it had been done already.
 

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Does Guhl mark the ecm after a reflash, maybe with a sticker or marker? I purchased a very well appointed 2018 and I wouldn’t be surprised if the original owner didn’t have this done, although the bike behaves like most describe before the reflash. I was just wondering if I took the ecm out if I could tell whether it had been done already.
You could probably shut it off in sport,rain or econ mode then restart. If still in one of those it got reflashed if in tour probably not. Notice I said probably.
 

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Does Guhl mark the ecm after a reflash, maybe with a sticker or marker? I purchased a very well appointed 2018 and I wouldn’t be surprised if the original owner didn’t have this done, although the bike behaves like most describe before the reflash. I was just wondering if I took the ecm out if I could tell whether it had been done already.
Stock EMC always revert back to Tour Mode.
 

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Does Guhl mark the ecm after a reflash, maybe with a sticker or marker? I purchased a very well appointed 2018 and I wouldn’t be surprised if the original owner didn’t have this done, although the bike behaves like most describe before the reflash. I was just wondering if I took the ecm out if I could tell whether it had been done already.
Yes, he does! Here is mine just returned a week ago!
A1963421-ED92-4361-8B14-C507B1AD874E.jpeg
 

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I would suspect that sticker would lower the value of your bike on a trade in.
 
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