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OK, so I purchased my wing near the end of June. I’ve not been extremely comfortable with it at slow speeds so I started practicing some of the things that Doug has been encouraging people to do in http://gl1800riders.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237208.

I’ve been struggling to get to the full scraping turns in 3rd, so I PM’d Doug for some additional help. He had me record some video of myself attempting the circles and gave me some additional pointers on things to do (for me, quit leaning with the bike, look up and over my shoulder (not down and ahead), and quit covering). Over the past couple weeks I’ve seen quite a bit of progress, while I’m not yet happy with where I am, I’m continuing to progress.

I didn’t manage to get out on the bike all weekend. Today, in New Hampshire it rained all day. I knew it was going to, and just didn’t care, I took the bike anyway (as it’s been so long since I’ve driven the truck I’ve managed to ruin the battery, so I didn’t really have much choice). After stopping by the local Honda shop (more on that later) I decided to stop by the local hockey rink that is between work and home (where they regularly hold MSF courses) and get in a few minutes of practice. Yes, it was actively raining, but I’d just had some success on Friday and hadn’t gotten a chance to reinforce what I’d done, so I figured I wouldn’t worry with the rain and just spend some time in the lot.

So I’d been there probably 10 minutes. Circles right, circles left, offset cone weave, repeat…
I’m doing circles and an SUV pulls up and a guy gets out and starts walking towards me. Did I mention it’s raining? Yea, still.
Ohhh, crap. It’s the manager of the Hockey rink and he’s going to tell me I can’t practice here, so I ride over to meet him.

Him: Are you Clark????
Me: Umm, no…
Him: No, you aren’t Clark?
Me: No, sorry.
Him: Ohh, well those are nice circles. You’re really good at that.
Me: Oh. Thanks.
Him: Sorry to interrupt.
Me: No problem.

So, I go back to doing circles. He drives to the other side of the lot and parks. After a few minutes I notice that he’s walking from where he parked towards me again (I’m like the only one in this side of the lot, so he has to be walking towards me), so again, I ride over to meet him.
Him: I’m sorry, but are you Charles?
Me: Umm, no, not Charles either.
Him: Well, are you a riding instructor?
Me: A riding instructor?, like for for an MSF course?
Him: Yes. I’m co-coaching an MSF course starting tonight and though that you might be my co-coach. I haven’t met him before, so I thought you might be him.
Me: Ohh, no, I’m not a coach. I just got this bike a couple months ago and haven’t felt comfortable, with it so I stop here every once in a while to get some practice time in.
Him: Ohhh, well you look great on it. Keep it up. That’s a really big bike and you’re running through the cones really well on it. I’m not sure I could do that and my bike isn’t nearly that big.
Me: Well thank you. I really appreciate it. I think I still have a long way to go, but I really appreciate the feedback.

I practices a few more minutes, and when I next looked up he had disappeared. Don’t know if he ever found his co-coach.

So, a big thank you to Doug for the help he’s already provided me (and others). Also, those that are just starting, beware. You will need to make a trip to the local Honda shop to replace some bits pretty quickly if you manage to succeed.



jason
 

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Where are you planning on using those 3rd gear peg scraping circles in everyday riding? I have never been in a position that I needed to scrape pegs while doing a circle turn,I guess it could come in handy on the beach or if your a instructor or in a circus.
 

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@Hazel -
Good question. Quite honestly I don't expect to be using peg scraping turns at idle much in my everyday riding.

What I have noticed since I've started practicing, however, is that my slow riding has improved significantly. I'm much more comfortable in parking lot type situations, so I have much more "attention" to devote to the things that are happening around me rather than trying to keep from falling over and worrying about the bike.

Scraping in 3rd is a step along a path, not an end. I could ask the same question of anyone who goes to a gym for example. Where, in everyday life are you going to need to lift 225lbs directly off of your chest using a bar? Well, prolly never, so I shouldn't try. I guess that's one way to look at it. I'm trying to treat this as more of something that I can exercise and get better at. I'll likely never compete in a top gun type even, but I'll never compete in Olympic power lifting either, but that doesn't mean that I should give up.

To each their own.

jason
 

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And how in the H,E double toothpicks did you wear out the TOP of your pegs :shrug:

Either way I am glad to hear you are feeling more confident !
 

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An interesting story. Congratulations for becoming good enough to impress a MSF instructor and also to wear out the rubber foot pads.

I've had mine since January and although I've ridden it 24k miles I am nowhere near that good yet. I would like to be doing the same thing but it is about 60 miles to Lubbock to the old Reese AFB airfield where the nearest MSF course is taught and where the lines are painted where I could practice.
 

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@Oneway -
It is rather strange isn't it :)

The pic is of the right side peg (i.e. the clutch side, not the throttle side), so forward is to the right in the picture (I don't think it looks like this in the picture, but it is the right peg, I only believe that because I just took it a little while ago and I know what side I was on).

I'm not yet comfortable enough to actually "observe" what's going on when the peg is dragging, so I can only assume that as the rubber starts to rub in the front that the friction is "pulling" the rest of it "off" the peg a bit and "eating" its way up the rubber. I ordered new rubber peg covers as well as the acorn nuts on bottom that are now almost through the acorn part and to the part I'll need to put a wrench on to take it off.

I tried taking some pics of the acorn nut, but I'm using my phone for the pics and none of them came out with anything that even looked like a part of a motorcycle :-(

jason
 

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just replaced a foot peg rubber that looked just like that. What happens is doing parking lot practice, if you are scraping the pegs, it wears on the bottom, causing the rubber to hang off like that.
 

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@Harvey -

I am fortunate in that I have a course on my way between work and home. It really helps being able to stop in "most" every day and spend 20-30 minutes. Having to drive an hour there and and hour back would "force" me to spend at least a couple hours practicing, and there's nothing wrong with long focused time, but it has been helpful for me to be able to 1. Ask questions of Doug, whose been nice enough to respond and 2. Simply reflect on things that I've done well and things that I haven't.

Having the stripes there is nice, but not a requirement. All of the circle type things are done "in free space". The offset cone weave that I do is based on the course, and it is very useful to have a reference to use (rather than just turn left and right in space), but you can accomplish this with 1/2 tennis balls (or as PepsX has found) empty water / gatorade bottles as well. If you can find a flat open lot, that's enough (I've had trouble with the flat part, even our MSF courses aren't all that flat).

jason
 

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working on the same stuff with Dj fire's help. no i dont plan on using this in everyday riding, but i do now know how the bike feels leaned way over and am getting comfortable with the feel of it. if you have to do an evasive emergency move at slow speed, do you know what it will feel like? or how fast a 90 deg turn you can make? or how about a U turn on a 24' road
I agree circles are just the first step to being confident in your riding ability and learning your limits and i know i have alot more to learn. but i do know if an expert offers free advice and help, and can ride like DJ can, I better listen and try to learn a thing or two.
so I'll throw in my .02, thanks for all the help Doug. :thumbup:
 

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Where are you planning on using those 3rd gear peg scraping circles in everyday riding? I have never been in a position that I needed to scrape pegs while doing a circle turn,I guess it could come in handy on the beach or if your a instructor or in a circus.
The idea is controlling the bike at low speeds and scraping the pegs for those that havn't done it to not freak out when it happens in everyday riding.

The thread is a really good read.
 

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I read it it is very informative, a good read. I wear out my pegs on the road Staying with those crazy BMW riders. It sure is funny for them to look back and see me on their back fender though.
 

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Hahaha... I love it when a smartass gets put in their place. Good on you Jasnmar - that was a beautiful and eloquent response. :)


@Hazel -
Good question. Quite honestly I don't expect to be using peg scraping turns at idle much in my everyday riding.

What I have noticed since I've started practicing, however, is that my slow riding has improved significantly. I'm much more comfortable in parking lot type situations, so I have much more "attention" to devote to the things that are happening around me rather than trying to keep from falling over and worrying about the bike.

Scraping in 3rd is a step along a path, not an end. I could ask the same question of anyone who goes to a gym for example. Where, in everyday life are you going to need to lift 225lbs directly off of your chest using a bar? Well, prolly never, so I shouldn't try. I guess that's one way to look at it. I'm trying to treat this as more of something that I can exercise and get better at. I'll likely never compete in a top gun type even, but I'll never compete in Olympic power lifting either, but that doesn't mean that I should give up.

To each their own.

jason
 

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First off.... thank you so much for the kind words.

Secondly... if we do not help each other, then what is the point to riding at all? I am always happy to help in any way I can. I obviously do not know everything, but I do know some things.



To those who do not understand how slow speed control equates to high speed control... think of the following...

If you take the time to truly learn the machine's lean limits and how your body feels when you are getting close to them, then evasive maneuvers are much safer and easier not to mention cookin' through the twisties.

The techniques I push are a fundamental change to how you ride.

Once you no longer fear your tires washing out from under you or the bike falling over when leaned way over, the fun can really begin. I don't care who you are, if you are a true motorcyclist then you have to agree that watching a motorcycle cook through a curve on just the right line with just the right body position and just a bit of sparks flying is a beautiful thing. Almost poetry in motion.

To those who think parking lot skillz can never help you. You are correct. They will never help YOU. You already know all you will ever need to know.... sounds bad doesn't it? If you tell yourself you can't improve your riding, then you will succeed in failing to improve.

I am not here to convince anyone that they really do not know how to ride. You want to try what I suggest, rock on. You don't... that works for me too. Everybody is an expert and knows everything until they run across the guy or gal who really does know what they are doing. The difficult part is keeping your mind open and your ego in check.

I am not the best, nor do I want to be, but I do have a few things to offer.


Again.. not here to convince anyone of anything. You think you want to work on your skills, I have some methods that will help you. Take what I offer and run with it, or deny it and continue to re-invent the wheel. It's up to you.
 

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I guess I'm not into wearing parts such as the clutch, pegs and so on.
Like DJ said
Once you no longer fear your tires washing out from under you or the bike falling over when leaned way over, the fun can really begin. I don't care who you are, if you are a true motorcyclist then you have to agree that watching a motorcycle cook through a curve on just the right line with just the right body position and just a bit of sparks flying is a beautiful thing. Almost poetry in motion.






 

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In addition to what was mentioned above, I can't count how many times I see people on bike bikes including Goldwings make a right hand turn from a stop sign swing all the way out and cross the center line just to make the turn. Also the duck walkers that walk with the bike to make the same turn until the bike gets up to a speed that is more comfortable for them. If you are happy riding that way then by all means continue to do so, but for me it is an unacceptable way to ride. Learning slow speed maneuvers eliminates both of the problems mentioned above.

As far as practical every day use, I have been in situations where I have been leading a group and there are problems near the back of the group. It's nice to be able to just get the group to the side of the road and swing the bike around in one smooth action and whip the bike back to where a problem may be.

Stuck in bumper to bumper traffic? It gives you a massive amount of confidence when you need to move into open spots quickly to keep moving.

The list goes on and on.

I'm sure there will be arguments as to why some prefer not to learn the techniques but it has worked great form me and saved me a few times when I needed to avoid something in front of me quickly. I knew that my bike would stay standing up no matter how hard I threw it around the object in front of me instead of slamming on the brakes.

DJ's techniques work, I just can't get used to the 3rd gear thing, I tried it a bunch of times. I have been using the Ride Like A Pro for a few years now and it has become habit. I need to feel the back brake drag to feel comfortable. Yes, I pay for it in replacement pads but the trade off is well worth it for me.
 

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Without a doubt DJ is a " top gun" great at teaching and the techniques can be useful.

What technique should of been used when DJ was riding stuck between 2 trucks at 70+mph pulling a trailer with no escape in case of emergency! None of these "look at me" I can scrape pegs in a circle can help in that situation.
Lets get to the page in the book that would of prevented that mishap that has put DJ in the Garage working on the messed up parts on his trailer and bike!
Just because you can't turn around in a 13' circle doesn't mean you can't ride.
Whatever way you have to turn around as long as it is safe and works for you it works for me.
if it is about impressing someone leave me out. Not everyone can be Ben Spies, or DJfire.
#1- Always have a escape route Don't put your bike in a position you cant get out of

I don't ride in groups! Very unsafe!



I read what the OP wrote and what DJ wrote and both of them had a little to do with" hey look at me" I look cool!

In addition to what was mentioned above, I can't count how many times I see people on bike bikes including Goldwings make a right hand turn from a stop sign swing all the way out and cross the center line just to make the turn. Also the duck walkers that walk with the bike to make the same turn until the bike gets up to a speed that is more comfortable for them. If you are happy riding that way then by all means continue to do so, but for me it is an unacceptable way to ride. Learning slow speed maneuvers eliminates both of the problems mentioned above.

As far as practical every day use, I have been in situations where I have been leading a group and there are problems near the back of the group. It's nice to be able to just get the group to the side of the road and swing the bike around in one smooth action and whip the bike back to where a problem may be.

Stuck in bumper to bumper traffic? It gives you a massive amount of confidence when you need to move into open spots quickly to keep moving.

The list goes on and on.

I'm sure there will be arguments as to why some prefer not to learn the techniques but it has worked great form me and saved me a few times when I needed to avoid something in front of me quickly. I knew that my bike would stay standing up no matter how hard I threw it around the object in front of me instead of slamming on the brakes.

DJ's techniques work, I just can't get used to the 3rd gear thing, I tried it a bunch of times. I have been using the Ride Like A Pro for a few years now and it has become habit. I need to feel the back brake drag to feel comfortable. Yes, I pay for it in replacement pads but the trade off is well worth it for me.
 

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Without a doubt DJ is a " top gun" great at teaching and the techniques can be useful.

What technique should of been used when DJ was riding stuck between 2 trucks at 70+mph pulling a trailer with no escape in case of emergency! None of these "look at me" I can scrape pegs in a circle can help in that situation.
Lets get to the page in the book that would of prevented that mishap that has put DJ in the Garage working on the messed up parts on his trailer and bike!
Just because you can't turn around in a 13' circle doesn't mean you can't ride.
Whatever way you have to turn around as long as it is safe and works for you it works for me.
if it is about impressing someone leave me out. Not everyone can be Ben Spies, or DJfire.
#1- Always have a escape route Don't put your bike in a position you cant get out of

I don't ride in groups! Very unsafe!



I read what the OP wrote and what DJ wrote and both of them had a little to do with" hey look at me" I look cool!
What did I write that says anything about looking cool? I'm talking about improving your skills to be able to ride safer with confidence. As far as DJ's accident, again it has nothing to do with what I wrote, nor did I say you couldn't ride because you can't turn in a 13' circle. I was in no way trashing you, or anybody else here. It is a matter of building skill sets to be able to call upon at the right time.

What I wrote was "If you are happy riding that way then by all means continue to do so, but for me it is an unacceptable way to ride" It's my choice to learn as much as I can to get to where I ride at a level that is acceptable to me.

I ride in groups because I am an assistant organizer for a group in New Jersey that has 400 members. I am a mentor for new riders and pass the skills I have onto anybody who wants to learn.

If you don't ride in groups, I can respect that, it's your decision. If you choose to not learn slow speed maneuvering, again it's your choice and I respect that.

Your question was "Where are you planning on using those 3rd gear peg scraping circles in everyday riding? I have never been in a position that I needed to scrape pegs while doing a circle turn,I guess it could come in handy on the beach or if your a instructor or in a circus." All I did was reiterate what was previously mentioned and interjected some of my own anecdotes.
 

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Way to go on trying become a better rider. It doesn't matter if scraping pegs in 3rd in a parking lot doesn't translate to everyday riding. You are learning to better control your bike.

Oh yeah... i just got back from a trip to Maine. I had to u-turn in the road no less than eight times during the trip, without pulling into a driveway. Slow speed manuevers come in handy everyday.

Congrats on practicing making for perfection.
 
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