Rear Brake lock up

5186 Views 28 Replies 15 Participants Last post by fgfan, May 11, 2014

WEGOTTAGW

Discussion Starter · May 4, 2014

So, took the ERC class yesterday in Salt Lake with DHeaton and 6 others, don't know if they were members here or not. About halfway through class, 2-3 hours in, my wife started riding 2up with me for the rest of the class. After the first excercise I noticed my rear brake starting to stick. After a few minutes of "rest" on the bike, it seemed to be fine again prior to the next excercise. Again during the riding it would start to stick. Let me preface that 2 weeks prior to the class, I took it in to the Honda dealer and that did a complete check on the bike, replaced the master cylinder from a past recall, changed oil, plugs and all fluids. I called the service manager during a break in class, and he said to bring it in after class and they would check it out. Leaving the class, after about 6 hours of riding, I rode about 10 miles to the dealer, once I got on the freeway, the rear brake gradually got worse, by the time I got off the exit, my rear tire brake felt like it was dragging badly. 2500 rpm was the only way to start off from stop, letting off the throttle at speed, the bike would come to a stop. By the time I got to the service department, the rear was almost completely locked up, and smoking. Service tech came out said it was caliper, I was wondering in anyone else has ever expeirenced this? Could it have been anything that the dealer did when they changed master cylinder recall? From the time they fixed the recall and did the service on the bike, I had put on about 100 miles. I am just wondering if all the friction zone riding in class might have had an adverse effect on the new master cylinder? No body else in class had any trouble with their brakes. Outside of the mishap, the wife and I had a great time meeting Dheaton and the others, I have to say that there are quality people that ride Goldwings!! Thanks Dave for all your input yesterday in class, any tips and help coming from veteran riders helps us "new" riders immensely!! The wife, being a "new" passenger, was really comforted listening to Dave and the rest of the guys there about how "safe" it is to tour. Thanks.

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oldguy

· #2 · May 4, 2014

Yeah I recently had it happen while in a group ride mine locked up in a gentle curve. Mine was an 03. Short ending I lost it and now have a new bike. I too had some slight issues the previous day that seemed to go away then hit me again without warning

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rayjoe

· #3 · May 4, 2014

Friction zone

Friction zone as it pertains to the ERC, is about clutch control and has nothing to do with the rear brake. Since the dealership worked on the rear brake system 100 miles ago I think you have found the culprit. If the dealership suggested the ERC as the problem. I think they are just covering their butt.

I taught the MSF courses for Team Oregon for 10 years and never had anyone complain about a brake problem, front or rear.

Rayjoe

WEGOTTAGW

Discussion Starter · #4 · May 4, 2014

Rayjoe, the dealership did not put blame on the ER C. In the use of the friction zone in low-speed maneuvers you have to ride your foot brake to keep control of speed so there was a lot of rear brake application in the exercises. I will wait to hear from the dealership on Tuesday to find out what the culprit is.

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Red

· #5 · May 4, 2014

I'm guessing rear brake reservoir was too full. You got the brakes hot which got the fluid hot. Brake fluid expands when it gets hot applying pressure on the pistons locking the pads against the rotors!

Probably be fine when fluid cools but problem will return if you get them hot again.

Good luck.....

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Fred H.

· #6 · May 4, 2014

Red said:
I'm guessing rear brake reservoir was too full. You got the brakes hot which got the fluid hot. Brake fluid expands when it gets hot applying pressure on the pistons locking the pads against the rotors!

Probably be fine when fluid cools but problem will return if you get them hot again.

Good luck.....

Sent from iPhone

That's about as good a guess as any. Another thing that could cause it would be a partially clogged return port in the rear brake master cylinder, or a brake pedel that isn't fully and completly returning properly for some reason.

Jack2

· #7 · May 4, 2014

Red said:
I'm guessing rear brake reservoir was too full. You got the brakes hot which got the fluid hot. Brake fluid expands when it gets hot applying pressure on the pistons locking the pads against the rotors!

Probably be fine when fluid cools but problem will return if you get them hot again.

Good luck.....

Sent from iPhone

If the dealer incorrectly used DOT 3 fluid instead of DOT 4 this could have also caused or contributed to the problem. DOT 3 has a lower boiling point than DOT 4.

Ed Kruse

· #8 · May 5, 2014

Secondary master cylinder pivot bolt!!!!!!!!

Corrosion on bolt causing it to hang up.

cddjake

· #9 · May 5, 2014

I also had the rear brake lockup--turned out to be the rear brake master cylinder

WEGOTTAGW

Discussion Starter · #10 · May 8, 2014

So I called Honda USA and got them involved with the case. They called the Honda dealership and talked with the service manager to find out the history of the recall fix and the status of the bike at present. The Service manager called yesterday to inform me that Honda was going to take care of all the repairs with no cost to me!:thumbup: The Honda dealership said that the master cylinder they replaced for the recall, was a "bad" part from the factory. They are replacing the rotor, master cylinder and potentially the caliper. I'll follow up once I get the bike back.

Fred H.

· #11 · May 8, 2014

WEGOTTAGW said:
So I called Honda USA and got them involved with the case. They called the Honda dealership and talked with the service manager to find out the history of the recall fix and the status of the bike at present. The Service manager called yesterday to inform me that Honda was going to take care of all the repairs with no cost to me!:thumbup: The Honda dealership said that the master cylinder they replaced for the recall, was a "bad" part from the factory. They are replacing the rotor, master cylinder and potentially the caliper. I'll follow up once I get the bike back.

Are you talking about the secondary master cylinder on the left front brake caliper, or the rear brake master cylinder down by the foot pedal?

mrbill21

· #12 · May 8, 2014

WEGOTTAGW said:
So I called Honda USA and got them involved with the case. They called the Honda dealership and talked with the service manager to find out the history of the recall fix and the status of the bike at present. The Service manager called yesterday to inform me that Honda was going to take care of all the repairs with no cost to me!:thumbup: The Honda dealership said that the master cylinder they replaced for the recall, was a "bad" part from the factory. They are replacing the rotor, master cylinder and potentially the caliper. I'll follow up once I get the bike back.

Good, that's the way it should be.

WEGOTTAGW

Discussion Starter · #13 · May 8, 2014

Fred H. said:
Are you talking about the secondary master cylinder on the left front brake caliper, or the rear brake master cylinder down by the foot pedal?

The combined braking systems secondary master cylinder, I don't know where it is located, sorry

Fred H.

· #14 · May 8, 2014

WEGOTTAGW said:
The combined braking systems secondary master cylinder, I don't know where it is located, sorry

That is the secondary master cylinder on the left front brake caliper, and the one that was subject of a recent recall campaign.

azsandrider

· #15 · May 9, 2014

Oldguy, didn't you have your master cylinder and/or calipers replaced just prior to your rear brake lockup?

Did you ever find out why they locked up after being 'fixed'?

I'm glad you were wearing proper riding gear when it occurred....

oldguy

· #16 · May 9, 2014

No I had had no work done. I also did not have the recall done. Just had the warnings the day before. They had not repeated so I ignored them

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fgfan

· #17 · May 9, 2014

I am presently fighting this problem. Took it in for recall and they said it passed and the problem was the rear master. Quoted $450 or so to repair. Said no thanks and I have gone thru rear, front, anti dive and so far the problem is still there. Will go thru front secondary master shortly. Also verified length of linkage of secondary master. Tried shorting it but nothing changed. Mine only gives me problems when riding in slow moving traffic, or after being parked for a short period.? Will free up by cycling rear and front brakes and proceeding slowly for a very short distance. It's not a problem while riding if I don't encounter extended traffic problems. Can tell immediately if it is acting up. Have not allow rear disc to over heat. Keep checking it with digital thermometer. if going thru secondary master doesn't yield some results, will call Honda.

Ed Kruse

· #18 · May 9, 2014

fgfan said:
I am presently fighting this problem. Took it in for recall and they said it passed and the problem was the rear master. Quoted $450 or so to repair. Said no thanks and I have gone thru rear, front, anti dive and so far the problem is still there. Will go thru front secondary master shortly. Also verified length of linkage of secondary master. Tried shorting it but nothing changed. Mine only gives me problems when riding in slow moving traffic, or after being parked for a short period.? Will free up by cycling rear and front brakes and proceeding slowly for a very short distance. It's not a problem while riding if I don't encounter extended traffic problems. Can tell immediately if it is acting up. Have not allow rear disc to over heat. Keep checking it with digital thermometer. if going thru secondary master doesn't yield some results, will call Honda.

Pull the pivot bolt out on the secondary mc. Clean and lube it, see if it helps. Slight corrosion will cause it hang up.

Fred H.

· #19 · May 9, 2014

fgfan said:
I am presently fighting this problem. Took it in for recall and they said it passed and the problem was the rear master. Quoted $450 or so to repair. Said no thanks and I have gone thru rear, front, anti dive and so far the problem is still there. Will go thru front secondary master shortly. Also verified length of linkage of secondary master. Tried shorting it but nothing changed. Mine only gives me problems when riding in slow moving traffic, or after being parked for a short period.? Will free up by cycling rear and front brakes and proceeding slowly for a very short distance. It's not a problem while riding if I don't encounter extended traffic problems. Can tell immediately if it is acting up. Have not allow rear disc to over heat. Keep checking it with digital thermometer. if going thru secondary master doesn't yield some results, will call Honda.

Have you checked that the front and rear brake reservoirs aren't overfull? There should be an air gap in them to allow fluid to return to the master cylinder when the brake is released.

Other things that cause the brake to stick are:

Clogged return port in the front or rear master cylinder
Aftermarket brake pedel or brake lever not allowing the brake lever to fully return
Rock or debris in the brake pedal mechanism not allowing it to return fully
Sticking brake piston on brake caliper
Caliper not able to slide properly and center itself, due to lack or lubrication on slide pin
Pinched or kinked brake line

The rear brake will make a slight dragging noise from the pads rubbing the rotor when the rear wheel is spun with the bike on the centerstand. This is normal. When you press on the brake you should feel the wheel lock up and when you release it, the wheel should then be able to be rotated easily by hand.

Since the secondary master cylinder applies force to the rear brake, it should also be checked as well as the left caliper pivot bolt and bearing. Push UP on the left caliper and make sure it freely swings back down when pressure is released. This is how it activates the rear brake. Then make sure the rear wheel spins freely after you release it.

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fgfan

· #20 · May 9, 2014

The suggestions I haven't done are go thru the secondary master and remove the left caliper. New and lubed pivot bolt, fluid level below max in reservoirs. Rear, front masters, and anti dive valve gone thru and cleaned. All looked perfect. Rear doesn't ever lock up just drags and then, only, in slow moving traffic and AFTER being PARKED for a short period of time.?? Thanks for all replys! Search goes on.

Emmett Hood
2010 Bagger

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