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Discussion Starter #1
Three of us were on a local ride yesterday when one of the bikes had a flat. He was running a Dunlop wintersport 175/60 Run Flat as am I on the rear of our goldwings. He had 8200 miles on the tire and it still looked very very good. The tire got very unstable and became completely unridable. When we were on the ground looking over the tire and rotating it looking for something in the tire we could hear something inside the tire moving around. Kind of like having gravel or something inside the tire. We could not pressure the tire with a small air pump and could not deturmine where the air was leaking from. But, when we heard the noise comming from inside the tire we stopped trying to fix it and hauled it in on a trailer.

This morning we dismouted the tire to find a major separation in the side wall of the tire. You can see the area of separation.




These are the pieces that were rolling around in the tire.



When the tire was dismounted we found a pretty substantial hole in the tire where the rider had run over a nail. With the size of the puncture there is no doubt that it was leaking from the puncture. The rider reported that he really didn't feel anything unusual until immediately before the tire became unridable.

This is the second Run-Flat tire that I have seen do this. The first one was a few months back and was replaced by a Honda dealer and I was not able to inspect nor get pictures of the failure.

However, I have no conclusions about the cause but I have some theories. I believe in both cases there was a puncture that caused the tires to go flat. I think that the riders, in both cases, failed to realize they were riding on flat tires. This is NOT a criticism of the riders but a realization that a run flat tire will not give you a lot of feed back that you have a flat tire. There is some feed back but it is very subtle. I reciently had a low tire an realized something didn't feel quite right. I stopped and checked my tire and found it down to 10 PSI. I aired it up and kept a close eye on it the remainder of the trip and fixed it when I got home. If you are not on you guard to very subtle changes then it is easy to miss that a tire is low or has no air. When ridden flat these tires will build up heat and fail to a point that the tire becomes unridable and unfixable.

At this point, we will never know at what point the tire had the puncture and lost all its air. Was it 10 minutes before the separation or 60 miles before the separation? Our trip legnth was 66 miles before the sparation occured. The rider had checked the air the previous day so the air had been checked about 150 miles before the separation occured but it was not checked before this particular ride.

Thoughs? I now have more questions than answers.

Patron
 

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Thoughs? I now have more questions than answers.

Patron
Just one thought... Don't know about the 175, but the other sizes are all specified for a minimum of a 5 1/2" rim (GL1800 is a 5" rim).. It would appear that there was lots of flexing going on in a manner the tire wasn't designed for or for a much longer time than it was designed for.. You are most likely correct that the tire had lost it's air long before it became unridable.. :shrug: Any signs of heat, discoloration or distortion on the loose pieces or around the failed area?
I'm sure others will have much more educated theories... :popcorn:
 

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A tire pressure sensor would be the answer I think. RF tires are only good for about 50 Miles from what I've read although they may be ok for more with the low weight from a bike.
 

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I'd be willing the Best a substantial amount of money that he had been riding it flat for some Time.
He might have checked his tire the day before and Immediately ran over a Nail. :shrug:
 

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Seems to me that the tire did it's job of protecting the rider from a flat at speed and who knows what else could have happened then. I've found that regular inspection of the tire for nails and screws is in order. I now have a tire monitor which is recommended for runflat tires... Cheers...:doorag:
 

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Seems to be a slight disturbance in the force. :lol:

Not really
Lets see someone Run a MT 100 miles flat
Hell lets see someone ride a MT a Mile Flat. I did it once and that tire was shot.
 

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I agree the RF did it's job. I also agree that this points out that we need to be a little more vigilant about checking air pressures, pre-ride inspections and be in tune to what it should feel like.

I'm sure the naysayers will be quick to blame the concept of a CT on a bike. But, we all know where to file their opinions.;)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
First, even though I have seen the problems that can occur with Run-Flat tires, I am sold on them. The point of my post was to make sure everyone was aware of what can happen if ridden flat too long. I really think that a TPMS would be a real benefit for most who wish to use a Run flat. You MUST be very diligent to watch the pressure and if you feel the slightest difference in feel of your ride you better stop and check pressure.

The Rest of the Story:

In my opening post I told you that a few weeks ago I felt something a little different and stopped and checked my pressure and it was down to 10 lbs. The rest of the story is that it was on a pretty desolate area of Mexico between Oaxaca and Veracruz. I aired it up and used a bottle of windex but never found the puncture. I went to Vearcruz and again aired it but never could find the puncture. The next morning before starting the tire was flat; wouldn't even measue on the guage. I rode it very slowly (flat) about a mile to the Pemex station and aired it again. Checked it at every gas stop and added a few lbs. when needed. It seemed to loose air a lot quicker when stopped than when traveling. I just didn't see that many good options in Mexico and I wasn't too worried about a slow leak. If I had been on a MC tire I would have surely had to find somewhere in Mexico for repairs.

Upon getting home in North Texas I dismounted the tire and found a nail. The head had broken off and the base was slightly imbedded under the tread so you couldn't see it. Patch-plug applied and everthing is good. I really have a lot of confidence in the Run flat CT's. I think they are far superior to MT's for both ride and safety. But, you have to be extremely diligent about thier care.

Be Safe,
Patron
 

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I posted this some time ago. http://gl1800riders.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196843

It basically repeats what RickMays said..


I agree the "Run Flat did it's job and stayed in one piece"
Now if this had been a MT ,it would look like this.



That tire was in Three pieces when it was taken off the wheel..




Wingy will be telling his story about his blowout from a hospital bed if he survives..:eek:4:
 

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Looks to me like a run flat that was run flat longer than it was designed for. A whole lot of unknowns.

I'm sticking with mine after seeing this.

:thumbup: me to!:agree:
 

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Looks to me like a run flat that was run flat longer than it was designed for. A whole lot of unknowns.

I'm sticking with mine after seeing this.

:agree:

I agree as well. I added a wireless TPM system to my bike. They are getting fairly cheap ($150 range) and give me a level of comfort while out on the road.
 

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What's the load range on those tires, can't be anywhere near 1200
 

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Looks to me like a run flat that was run flat longer than it was designed for. A whole lot of unknowns.

I'm sticking with mine after seeing this.

You are correct..That is not a seperation..but a tire that was run flat..When a tire looses there air pressure,the rim rides on the sidewall of the tires..Causing the tire to start comming apart ...If it was not a run flat,it would have beens alot worse..The tire would have been realy tore up...
 

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Early recognition of low pressure is important. One of the tell tail signs is heavy steering in the cornering. Cheers...:doorag:
 

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Open mindedness is a great gift.


THE TAKE
What this ought to prompt everyone to do is to check their inner wall.
Patron has seen this twice now. Examine well used CT's inner walls and report to the rebel forces.

It beehoves everyone to use this incident as a caveat for things that we may have overlook in the performance of CT. I have seen the pics of ripped to shreds external sidewall (on CT) from riding like maniacs around the mountains (twisties). Not comforting for the hot rodders.

THE CAVEAT

Has anyone check to see the inside of some of the badly worn tires on the outside. Can anyone else experienced this breaking down of the inner wall.

Is this only happening to the 175? Will the bigger tires on the small 5" rim be even more prone to inner wall breaking down?

It is a given that motto OEM are worthless for the cause of touring. I dont think bring up "what would have happened if..." makes a difference.

This is what irks me: the lack of objectivity. I just about can't stand it anymore when people come out in 'emotional defense' of CT.


THE WHINE
What if someone would come up with empirical evidence that motto driving forces applied to CT cause them to fall apart on the inside? Would you still ride on one because, because, because...you are a faithfull darksider?

Jesus Christmas Holy Eastern, this board is losing the culture of the pioneers' quest to achieve a more efficacious asphaltian rollability. It is being replaced by blind-loyalty to an anti-OEM cult that seems to provide a sense of belonging rather a more efficient motorcycle part....Mercy!

THE COMEDY

Let me tell you, motto tires have many characteristics that are preferable to CT....for example, err,...let me think...well, I can't think of any right now...well, you just ask Lean, he knows!


THE FINALE
I guess, I just don't have faith on any tire!...I am not using the force, am I?
 

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:agree:

I agree as well. I added a wireless TPM system to my bike. They are getting fairly cheap ($150 range) and give me a level of comfort while out on the road.
I'm definitely thinking about this. In a way, the runflat is doing too good of a job. If you get a flat but don't know it, then drive way too fast / far with it flat, the next level of failure may not be any better than any other non-RF tire. Still, the rider didn't "crash & burn". Any landing you walk away from is a good one, so the RF did its job.

The warnings for the RF tires state that a TPM system should be used. This failure really proves the point. I've run a couple of tires low where something felt wrong, but for any number of reasons I didn't pull over and check it out right away.

Thanks for this thread. I'm really glad you shared this info as it will help everyone to stay vigilant and observant.
 

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This is what I started using:
http://autodax.com/catalog/pdetail.php?prdid=208

No wiring at all. Just install the batteries and put the valve caps on.

Pressure and temperature.

I used a bit of velcro to put mine on the instrument panel. A little bit of nylon cord for a tether, just in case.
 

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AAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaahhhhh

I was thinking, "'yea Richard, that is the answer"...then: 209 dollars? ouch!
that's a lot of money to pay for checking the tire pressure for ya...Man!

It's the right idea though. Who would have thought that now I have to pay 209 dollars to protect myself against the safety traits of a runflat CT installed in my motto.
 
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