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I didn't read the whole thread through, excuse me for that, but are these circles full-lock?
Definitely not lock to lock. But trying to ride in progressively smaller circles, and experience the sensation of dragging the pegs/floorboards. Really need to read the first five pages of this thread, mostly written by the OP. But be forewarned, you may get hooked too. :)
 

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Definitely not lock to lock. But trying to ride in progressively smaller circles, and experience the sensation of dragging the pegs/floorboards. Really need to read the first five pages of this thread, mostly written by the OP. But be forewarned, you may get hooked too. :)
I've been practicing slow tight turns on every bike I've owned since 2006, and my 2006 Wing since I bought it a year ago. At the end of a ride I almost always gas up at the same Shell station near my house and then practice a few minutes of 8's and full lock circles in the parking lot adjacent to the Shell before heading home. On the exit road out of the lot I usually practice chirping the front tire a couple a times from 25-30 mph. Chirping is a front tire lock up and release drill.The exit road is an abandoned block-long road with virtually no traffic. In the parking lot I try to turn 8's inside a box 18 feet by 36 feet but Winging it I'm at about 20' by 40'. 18' by 36' is four adjoining parking spots.
 

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I inspected the bike today. The hard parts that dragged occasionally were the at bottom base of the floorboards, where it protrudes down about 1". On the left side, the kickstand foot was also dragging. That same area of the left floorboard pushes the kickstand down 1", otherwise, the kickstand would not be dragging. I believe, with OEM pegs, the only part dragging would be the pegs. Gonna find out soon, as I plan to reinstall the pegs once the steel, "peg scrapers" I ordered from [email protected] arrive. They are simply a steel button that attaches to the end of each peg, to shield the aluminum end of the peg.
 

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Last night I re-read this entire thread. This morning I reset the rear suspension preload to 25, where I usually leave it. Then I went back to the parking lot, and rode 3rd gear circles for a little over an hour. Not sure how many circles, but I did keep it to around 10 before changing directions. Per the odometer, I rode a little over 10 miles, in circles. LOL

Today the first 10-20 circles were like starting over, but I soon began scraping the floorboards again. Later, I began scraping them at least some during every circle. I usually scraped about 1/4th of the way around the circle, but several times over half way around, and a few times probably 2/3rd of the way. I also hit hard parts occasionally, so I am sure there will be plenty of evidence as to which hard parts scraped, once I get round to inspecting the bike. I did flip up the floorboards and look at their skid pads. Both are worn all the way through, and into the aluminum, but I don't mind. Curiously, whichever hard parts are scraping, it's not the ERGOs, as I had speculated would be.

I believe I could almost scrape all the way around the circle, at least occasionally, but there are a few challenges in the parking lot: it is sloped; has patches of loose gravel, twigs and debris, several large chunks of asphalt scattered about, and a few telephone poles right up on the edge of the asphalt. The GL1800 easily chugs around the circle, but slows down a bit when going uphill. At top of the hill is where it is most difficult to keep scraping, due to slower speed and the downhill angle working against me. However, going downhill and at the bottom of the hill is where scraping is easiest. If I ever find a nice, level parking lot, like in the OP's videos, I may think it's too easy. LOL

Definitely gonna keep this up, as it's getting funner every time I do it.
SO THATS HOW YA GOT 50,000 MILES ON IT THIS YEAR !! :surprise::laugh::laugh::wink2:
 

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Today I spent a half hour in the parking lot. It was near dark when I started, and good and dark when finished. There are a couple of street light, but the lighting is only so-so. I also rode on the AirHawk today, since I ride on it about 90 percent of the time anyway, figured it would be good to include in practice. The AirHawk rounded off the high side's corner on the seat, so made it feel a bit awkward, compared to just the seat. The poor lighting had me focused on a closer distance because couldn't see very far anyway.

Last time it took the first 10-20 circles before scraping the first floorboard, but today it was on the second circle. Still, I scraped much less today, overall. Probably due to the AirHawk and lighting.

Thank goodness for the car tire (double dark), which makes it easier to maneuver, and just seems safer. ;)
 

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Today I spent a half hour in the parking lot. It was near dark when I started, and good and dark when finished. There are a couple of street light, but the lighting is only so-so. I also rode on the AirHawk today, since I ride on it about 90 percent of the time anyway, figured it would be good to include in practice. The AirHawk rounded off the high side's corner on the seat, so made it feel a bit awkward, compared to just the seat. The poor lighting had me focused on a closer distance because couldn't see very far anyway.

Last time it took the first 10-20 circles before scraping the first floorboard, but today it was on the second circle. Still, I scraped much less today, overall. Probably due to the AirHawk and lighting.

Thank goodness for the car tire (double dark), which makes it easier to maneuver, and just seems safer. ;)
NOTHING LIKE A "WONKY " TIRE ! :wink2::laugh:
 
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Another thing I noticed last night, I became much more dizzy than before. I believe it is similar to a childhood experience most can identify with: closing the eyes then spinning around and around, we became much dizzier than if our eyes were open. At least that's what I recall, haven't tried it in decades. LOL
 

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Any of you guys have a problem with the bar ends hitting your knees at full lock? I can stick my knees out but that just reduces stability with my knees out there. I have a Russell seat that I believe is about an 1" higher and 2" back but the bars still hit my knees.

I looked at the bar riser options I could find and they all seem to go up and back. I do not want the grips to come back. Just up.

As a side note. I have competed in the police type competitions, but always on an adventure tourer. My BMW R1200GS or Aprilia Caponord. Some Harley riding friend jokingly accused me a cheating. I took my buddies Road King out for a ride a few days ago. I was cheating. The Beemer is way way easier to ride. I'd say the wing is harder to ride then the RK.
 

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Any of you guys have a problem with the bar ends hitting your knees at full lock? I can stick my knees out but that just reduces stability with my knees out there. I have a Russell seat that I believe is about an 1" higher and 2" back but the bars still hit my knees.

I looked at the bar riser options I could find and they all seem to go up and back. I do not want the grips to come back. Just up.

As a side note. I have competed in the police type competitions, but always on an adventure tourer. My BMW R1200GS or Aprilia Caponord. Some Harley riding friend jokingly accused me a cheating. I took my buddies Road King out for a ride a few days ago. I was cheating. The Beemer is way way easier to ride. I'd say the wing is harder to ride then the RK.
No problems with the bar ends, but I have the bar-backs that bring the handlebars up, back, and inward. The same company makes them that only come up and back. I forget the name, but they cost about $75. Not sure if I'd have problems with the OEM setup, since the bar-backs were one of the first things I installed.

I agree, for me, the GW is definitely harder to ride than my old Harley. But then, I never tried to deliberately scrape the pegs on the last Harley; only the ones I rode in much younger days, and I was never very good at it anyway. Nowadays, just trying to learn to be. safer rider, and the slow speed maneuvering drills are gonna help, IMHO.
 

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Wanna clarify, I mislabeled the, "Peg Scrapers" I mentioned ordering above. The correct label is Peg Savers, and that is exactly what they are supposed to do. They are a metal button, available in aluminum, steel and titanium, that save the aluminum pegs from being scraped away in short order, if dragged. I intend to install them before trying the drills with the OEM pegs. Currently, the OEMs are in mint condition. LOL

To reiterate what I posted somewhere above, I ordered the Peg Savers from Pepsx.com, via a link, [email protected], per an older post in this thread.
 

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Any of you guys have a problem with the bar ends hitting your knees at full lock? I can stick my knees out but that just reduces stability with my knees out there. I have a Russell seat that I believe is about an 1" higher and 2" back but the bars still hit my knees.

I looked at the bar riser options I could find and they all seem to go up and back. I do not want the grips to come back. Just up.

As a side note. I have competed in the police type competitions, but always on an adventure tourer. My BMW R1200GS or Aprilia Caponord. Some Harley riding friend jokingly accused me a cheating. I took my buddies Road King out for a ride a few days ago. I was cheating. The Beemer is way way easier to ride. I'd say the wing is harder to ride then the RK.
I am 71" tall, with 32" inseam, and 175 pounds; no problems yet with bar ends hitting me anywhere, but I am probably not riding no where near as aggressive as you. Just trying to practice slow speed maneuvering, for the safety related benefits the OP described. However, I also have the bar-backs that bring the bars up, back and inward. The same company, which I have forgotten, makes them that only bring the bars up and back. Not sure if the OEM bar position would be a problem for me, as the bar-backs were one of the first mods I did to this GW.
 

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@JoeHall, I'm getting dizzy just thinking about your ride. Happy circling!

It is a good calibration & skill development exercise. I need to get back out there.
Another thing I noticed last night, I became much more dizzy than before. I believe it is similar to a childhood experience most can identify with: closing the eyes then spinning around and around, we became much dizzier than if our eyes were open. At least that's what I recall, haven't tried it in decades. LOL

Interesting to read of your progress with this. I try to get in some parking lot practice from time to time, and even paid a local training place for an hour of their time to help me with some slow speed parking lot maneuvers. My problem with the circles is I get dizzy very easily. More than one circle and it's not safe. :frown2:
 
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Any of you guys have a problem with the bar ends hitting your knees at full lock? I can stick my knees out but that just reduces stability with my knees out there. I have a Russell seat that I believe is about an 1" higher and 2" back but the bars still hit my knees.

I looked at the bar riser options I could find and they all seem to go up and back. I do not want the grips to come back. Just up.

As a side note. I have competed in the police type competitions, but always on an adventure tourer. My BMW R1200GS or Aprilia Caponord. Some Harley riding friend jokingly accused me a cheating. I took my buddies Road King out for a ride a few days ago. I was cheating. The Beemer is way way easier to ride. I'd say the wing is harder to ride then the RK.
I did. I put in the show chrome "risers" which are just little wedge shaped shims that go under where the handlebars attach to the top of the triple tree. Problem solved. Fairly cheap and easy install. Though pricey for a pair of shims.

I read all about the up and back and out an in. I don't recall what they advertised, but I didn't want any back and didn't feel like I got any.
 

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My problem with the circles is I get dizzy very easily. More than one circle and it's not safe. :frown2:
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Why would you practice more than one circle at a time? When, in real riding, do you need to turn more than 180°? I should think making consecutive 180° turns, like with the lines in a parking lot, would be about 98% of what you need. That gives you the 3 phases of turns: setup, maneuver, recover. What has to happen is consistently going into each phase smoothly and without thinking. (Without thinking means automatic body position, clutch use, throttle use, proper gear, handlebar position, and head direction.)

--
 

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Why would you practice more than one circle at a time? When, in real riding, do you need to turn more than 180°? I should think making consecutive 180° turns, like with the lines in a parking lot, would be about 98% of what you need. That gives you the 3 phases of turns: setup, maneuver, recover. What has to happen is consistently going into each phase smoothly and without thinking. (Without thinking means automatic body position, clutch use, throttle use, proper gear, handlebar position, and head direction.)

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It is to get used to the idea of how far you actually can lean, and to make complete circles dragging the pegs. It's all part of the lesson plan in DJ Fire's tutorial. Very few people are as qualified as he is to teach this lesson.

I've seen lately that I have to get back to doing PLP and controlling the bike in tight, low-speed turns. This thread has valuable info!
 
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Today I modified the kickstand and bottom of the left floorboard slightly, and gained 1/2" of kickstand clearance; the floorboard now only pushes it down 1", instead of 1.5". I guesstimate this surely will delay kickstand drag by a little.

I next dropped rear shock preload to zero, to increase likelihood of dragging. I then went to the parking lot and rode 3rd gear circles about an hour. At first I was counting 10/10, but later just rode 4-5 minutes in each direction; estimated total of at least 150 circles each way. As I improved counterbalancing and stiff arming, circle radii became smaller. Later the boards began to drag, at first just a kiss now and then, but eventually almost every circle, and dragged longer and longer. Max drag was about 1/3rd of a circle, but usually much less. I also felt a, "hard part" drag a few times, likely the ERGOs, kickstand, or both. Will put the bike on the center stand later and look for evidence.

I realize if the suspension is at max preload, dragging will be delayed, but for now just trying to experience what dragging feels like. I also realize this practice can be dangerous. Today I had two close calls: once I was headed for a telephone pole, with loose gravel near it. That was the only time I hit the brake today. Another time, the bike seemed to lean too far, I panicked and put my right foot out (but not down). I later realized my right foot had been rearward, very near the rear crash bar, and if I'd put it down, the crash bar likely woulda broken my ankle. Yep, even in a semi-controlled scenario, things can go sideways very quickly.

Leaning any motorcycle over as far as today is definitely outside of my experience and skill set. But it's also fun, and I like learning new things.


Hey Joe, I found keeping my head up, and exaggerating this, I’m able to lean further and also keep an eye of what’s going on. If i look down at all when im leaning it throws the bike of balance. I feel like the same things you do trying to stay balanced athletically apply here. If Im standing on one foot I try to look straight ahead and head up. I’ve been learning that riding the motorcycle relies much more on your peripheral vision. When I do cone weaves and I look straight ahead, even up, the cones feel more spacious. As soon as I look at them I have less room. I practice being aware of peripheral vision when I’m riding in traffic too. The moment I look at an obstacle I go towards it, but when I’m calmly aware of it in my periphery it I avoid it better:

Also in 3rd gear the bike is going faster so the turns will be larger.

Just installed the pegsx steel pucks, install went great. It helped that I had a reamer, because it’s hard to get the hole perfectly centered, so you may have to enlarge it. Also I only had an electric drill, which kinda left the hole a little jagged. The reamer helped smooth it out.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Hello all
These slow speed control exercises work. I’ve been at it for about 3 wks. 15 -30 mins a day and my skill level has improved dramatically. Dj fires techniques are transferrable, allow you to go at your own pace, and most importantly make things more understandable. And I’m more in control of myself and the bike. Hint-get you some pepsx peg pucks they’ll save your pegs.

Thanks DJ Fire for sharing your expertise. ??
 

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This thread has motivated me to start working on my slow speed maneuvering. With that said, I ordered and installed some Peg Savers. Thought I'd pass along how I marked the holes. Using the steps outlined in the pics below I got the holes accurately drilled first time without the need to enlarge an off-center hole.

You mentioned a 5/8 hole in the 7th pic - that's pretty big! Do you mean 5/16"? (To me, it looks more like 5/16 than 5/8.)
 

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This thread has motivated me to start working on my slow speed maneuvering. With that said, I ordered and installed some Peg Savers. Thought I'd pass along how I marked the holes. Using the steps outlined in the pics below I got the holes accurately drilled first time without the need to enlarge an off-center hole.




** Tadpole - Thanks for catching my error. I reposted with the correct 5/16" size.
 

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Discussion Starter #240
I have to say, it's very rewarding to be able and sit back and watch you guys help out the newer folks. Almost all of you who are trying to help are on point.

Keep at it!
 
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