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Discussion Starter #41 (Edited)
2013 F6b with transmission problem

Guy from SC calls. He has a 2013 F6b with 30k that hiccups in 2nd. He says that several dealers have never heard of his issue, and one called Honda, and they have never heard of it either. And all are saying that it is his fault. Someone on the forum here directed him to me. Since under normal test riding conditions it is not reproducible, he's trading it in a 2018. My advised was to trade it in today before it manifests into a very reproducible condition.

His issue is due to hi/low dog design, it is not his fault, and if he wants it repaired, he will need his gears undercut.
 

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Discussion Starter #42
More 2013 F6b's with transmission problems

More 2013 F6b's with transmission problems. One guy to days calls from the Clearwater, FL. area. I think his had 86k on the ODM. The other called from MS. His has 58k on the ODM. Both complained about their problems was in 2nd gear.
 

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I’m enjoying reading your posts Greg. Sounds like I got off fairly fortunate when I bought my 2005 in 2011 with 16k on the clock and no Honda warranty. Has almost 69k now and very few issues, biggest of them being the ECU that a fellow inmate helped me R&R last winter.


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More 2013 F6b's with transmission problems. One guy to days calls from the Clearwater, FL. area. I think his had 86k on the ODM. The other called from MS. His has 58k on the ODM. Both complained about their problems was in 2nd gear.

Greg,


I know this is a general type question, but what does a transmission repair cost? Generally, and I would guess that there are different kinds of transmission problems that would cause the prices to vary.


Are we talking $1000, or $ $5000?



AS far as selling a m/c with a bad tranny, I don't think I could do that. Knowingly selling a defective bike that could leave a rider stranded on the road is an awful deed. I've been stranded 3 times with my Harleys and it's a REAL LOUSY feeling. And depending on where you are stranded, it can also be VERY dangerous.


I'm thinking about riding in some of the Western States in the middle of the Summer out on an open highway, miles away from any town, and you get a problem that you can't fix roadside. Those Summer temps out there could cause you to get a heat stroke.
 

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Discussion Starter #45 (Edited)
Greg,


I know this is a general type question, but what does a transmission repair cost? Generally, and I would guess that there are different kinds of transmission problems that would cause the prices to vary.


Are we talking $1000, or $ $5000?
I offer 3 repairs. The price is based on a naked Wing with no accessories. All 3 repairs include the same basic parts-package: gasket, seals, o-rings, lock-nuts, 5th gear in, 2/3 slider, a center fork, piston rings, oil & filter, air filter, spark plugs, coolant, and brake fluid to bleed the clutch. The case halves are professional clean, the cylinder walls measure for excessive taper, and honed for new rings.

All transmissions are magna-fluxed for damage and wear, and the shafts put on a lathe checked for excessive runout.

- a basic repair is around $5,300. This repair comes with a 3mth warranty on parts and labor.
- a repair with undercut gears $6,300. This repair comes with a 6mth warranty on parts and labor.
- upgrading to 2014 undercut gears is $7,550. This repair comes with a 1year warranty on parts and labor.

Other than what is stated above, all repairs may need add'l parts. But with few exception, they all get what is stated above.

Because of cost to repair, I'm beginning to consider "bring me your Wing and a used engine," and I'll install it. However, the problem with that is that the customer might end up paying again to have another engine installed, since the used engine market on 5th gens is flooded with transmission problems. A few years ago, one member here installed 2 engines before setting his Wing aside. His Wing had ADG problems, the first replacement engine dii too, and the 2nd engine had transmission problems. Since there is no way of predicting these failures on used engine, no one wants to take responsibility on the "what ifs."
 

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Discussion Starter #46 (Edited)
I’m enjoying reading your posts Greg. Sounds like I got off fairly fortunate when I bought my 2005 in 2011 with 16k on the clock and no Honda warranty. Has almost 69k now and very few issues, biggest of them being the ECU that a fellow inmate helped me R&R last winter.


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Most still do get lucky. However, as these Wings age, drop in value, and because of Honda's hi/low dog design in the transmission, and the cost to correct it, this generation is slowly dying. The hi/low dog design is killing off many 5th gen Wings. The transmission issue is killing them off faster than they are being totaled from accidents.
 

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I offer 3 repairs. The price is based on a naked Wing with no accessories. All 3 repairs include the same basic parts-package: gasket, seals, o-rings, lock-nuts, 5th gear in, 2/3 slider, a center fork, piston rings, oil & filter, air filter, spark plugs, coolant, and brake fluid to bleed the clutch. The case halves are professional clean, the cylinder walls measure for excessive taper, and honed for new rings.

All transmissions are magna-fluxed for damage and wear, and the shafts put on a lathe checked for excessive runout.

- a basic repair is around $5,300. This repair comes with a 3mth warranty on parts and labor.
- a repair with undercut gears $6,300. This repair comes with a 6mth warranty on parts and labor.
- upgrading to 2014 undercut gears is $7,550. This repair comes with a 1year warranty on parts and labor.

Other than what is stated above, all repairs may need add'l parts. But with few exception, they all get what is stated above.

Because of cost to repair, I'm beginning to consider "bring me your Wing and a used engine," and I'll install it. However, the problem with that is that the customer might end up paying again to have another engine installed, since the used engine market on 5th gens is flooded with transmission problems. A few years ago, one member here installed 2 engines before setting his Wing aside. His Wing had ADG problems, the first replacement engine dii too, and the 2nd engine had transmission problems. Since there is no way of predicting these failures on used engine, no one wants to take responsibility on the "what ifs."

Thanks for the info Greg. Those figures are what I'd call major money. I had never heard about Honda Transmission failures before. I guess every manufacturer has it issues.



With the possibility of this type of failure, I can see why you say to get a Honda Warranty. It's really a no-brainer at the prices that Honda charges.
 

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Gregg,
What should I be doing for my 2010(Roadsmith) trike? {my triked is babied by the way/no hot shot rides}

1)Oil and filter is being changed at 3,000 miles or even less

2) Anti freeze fluid replaced every season

3) Air filter replaced (found loaded with M&m's candies) ???

4) Always garaged

5) never ridden in rain (unless caught in storm: crying: )

6) front fork seals and bushings, spring replaced

7) Grease jirks are giving shot of grease every month

8) This bike is babied

Ronnie
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Gregg,
What should I be doing for my 2010(Roadsmith) trike? {my triked is babied by the way/no hot shot rides}

1)Oil and filter is being changed at 3,000 miles or even less

2) Anti freeze fluid replaced every season

3) Air filter replaced (found loaded with M&m's candies) ???

4) Always garaged

5) never ridden in rain (unless caught in storm: crying: )

6) front fork seals and bushings, spring replaced

7) Grease jirks are giving shot of grease every month

8) This bike is babied

Ronnie
Follow the maintenance schedule in the Owner's Manual to a tee. Avoid skipping over anything on the schedule. RoadSmith also has a maintenance schedule. Follow theirs also. There's never anything wrong with doing various services on a schedule early, but there can be everything wrong with doing it late. Also, the best oil for 5th gens Wings is Honda GN4 conventional oil. For your year, be sure to use 10w-30.
 

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Follow the maintenance schedule in the Owner's Manual to a tee. Avoid skipping over anything on the schedule. RoadSmith also has a maintenance schedule. Follow theirs also. There's never anything wrong with doing various services on a schedule early, but there can be everything wrong with doing it late. Also, the best oil for 5th gens Wings is Honda GN4 conventional oil. For your year, be sure to use 10w-30.
:kiss::kiss::kiss:

Thank you!

Ronnie
 

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Discussion Starter #51 (Edited)
2005 bought from dealer as is

A guy calls last weekend. He'd bought a 2005 "as is" from the dealer with 40 some k on the ODM. He paid $1800. He called to see if I knew what the engine noise was. The dealer thought it was a "throw-out bearing." After talking for a few mins, and requesting a video that captures the noise, he mentioned that the noise follows the RPMs to 0 when he turns it off. That can be a tell-tail sign of a bad ADG.

He's gonna do what many GoldWing owners do ... sell the Wing and pass the problem on to someone else.
 

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A guy calls last weekend. He'd bought a 2005 "as is" from the dealer with 40 some k on the ODM. He paid $1800. He called to see if I knew what the engine noise was. The dealer thought it was a "throw-out bearing." After talking for a few mins, and requesting a video that captures the noise, he mentioned that the noise follows the RPMs to 0 when he turns it off. That can be a tell-tail sign of a bad ADG.

He's gonna do what many GoldWing owners do ... sell the Wing and pass the problem on to someone else.
Greg, I trust your diagnosis judgment. Did this person buy the bike from a Honda dealer? Why would a dealer think the sound originates from a "throw-out bearing?" Shouldn't a dealer with any degree of Goldwing experience also know the tell-tale sign of a bad ADG? If the Goldwing owner does sell the Wing, he will be no more culpable than the dealer that sold it to him. I'm not suggesting that it is right, but dealers, especially Honda dealers, should act honestly disclosing what they know to a buyer, even with an "as is" sale.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
Greg, I trust your diagnosis judgment. Did this person buy the bike from a Honda dealer? Why would a dealer think the sound originates from a "throw-out bearing?" Shouldn't a dealer with any degree of Goldwing experience also know the tell-tale sign of a bad ADG? If the Goldwing owner does sell the Wing, he will be no more culpable than the dealer that sold it to him. I'm not suggesting that it is right, but dealers, especially Honda dealers, should act honestly disclosing what they know to a buyer, even with an "as is" sale.
Yes ... he said he bought it from dealer. They had it advertised for $2,800 but he offered them $1,800 and they took it. I have no idea why a dealer would blame it on throw-out bearing. 5th gens do not have throw-out bearings. However, over the years, I have had many say the same. Sorry, I have no idea what a dealer should or should not know.
 

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Interesting

A guy calls last weekend. He'd bought a 2005 "as is" from the dealer with 40 some k on the ODM. He paid $1800. He called to see if I knew what the engine noise was. The dealer thought it was a "throw-out bearing." After talking for a few mins, and requesting a video that captures the noise, he mentioned that the noise follows the RPMs to 0 when he turns it off. That can be a tell-tail sign of a bad ADG.

He's gonna do what many GoldWing owners do ... sell the Wing and pass the problem on to someone else.
I'd think a buyer would be very cautious buying a bike that far under market value. He could fix the ADG and still have the bike at a decent price, if it is in good shape otherwise.
 

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Discussion Starter #55 (Edited)
I received this PM today

"New to the forum and all roads lead to you because of your vast knowledge with these beasts . I have sunk some cash into this 1800 and fifth gear OD is done . I don’t have another $5000 to put into repairing it . Honestly how much am I looking at on the high end? I’m a little frustrated because I just didn’t know what I was looking for when I bought the 1800. I have three others 2 1500 and a 86 1200 . Still ride it in forth some around town.
Love the bike but I have to figure this out . I was almost ashamed because I’ve had my it for Only about a month . I’m gonna check with some local shops tomorrow but wanted to know what I should be asking . Thanks for any input"

My reply

"I'm trying to read between the lines, but I think you are saying that you've "sunk some cash" into the purchase of a GL1800, and now you're having problems with 5th gear, and you don't have another $5,000 to spend on its repair.

If the above is true, I'm sorry to hear that you also have a Wing with a transmission problem.

Sometimes the final repair costs includes repairing the damage to the oiling system too. Your Wing has probably been having transmission problems for a couple of years, and it is now to the point where 5th is no longer used. Each time the transmission exposed its problem, a little bit more metal was chipped off a gear(s) and that metal goes into the oil. On some, and because metal is in the oil, over time it not only turns into a transmission repair but dealing with main/rod bearings, and an oil pump too. Therefore a final price is not known until the engine is completely torn down and inspected.

However, your repair will likely be more than $5,000.

Hopefully that answers your question. If you need further information, please call.

As always, my best advise is to not buy a used GL1800 unless is comes with at least a year remaining on its Honda warrantee. The GL1800 used market is flooded with transmission problems.

Greg - owner
JustWings - GL1800 Specialty Service and Repair
813-416-8600 "
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Flattery ... yesterday a rider rode from somewhere to have me listen to his ADG ... normal !!! I don't mind at all taking a moment out of my day to listen to someones Wing ... it is flattering they chose me to listen to their concern. It's also flattering to be chosen to fix something that was fixed before. I've think I've done 5 or 6 transmission repairs that were repaired by other shops only to fail again. Most flattering is when dealers direct their work to me, or ship their work to me ... I like those best :)
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Sorry ... I used to log my calls, but quit doing that. As a result, I write here less. In the last 27 days, I've talked to several with transmission issues. A guy calls today from some state up North. He says there is a 2010 with something like 6,000 miles on it about 3hrs away that he wants to buy for $8,000. Somehow, after searching about 5th gen GW issues, and reading of the many who had/have transmission issues he somehow finds my number and calls me. It'll be his first Wing, and he's finally switching from a Harley.

As with all, I'm never the one who really likes to share bad news, but the reality is, without test riding one, and owning it for at least 6mths, there is no way of knowing if its has transmission issues. He was surprise to here that I've repaired ones with about half the mileage of the one he want to buy.

What did he decide ... I really don't know, but as always, my advise was to buy one with at least 1yr of Honda warranty left. I explained that could be a 2014 under it's extended 4yr warranty, or a used 2016 bought in 2018. I believe he left the conversation seriously thinking a NOS 2016 at a local dealer was gonna be his best deal. He said something about his monthly payment being only $70 more.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
Dan from OH called. His Wing he'b bought cheap because the prior owner disclosed that it had a transmission issue. It's also currently in the shop, and the engine is currently being torn open for repair. Basically Dan called to purchase a transmission that is already under cut and ready to be installed. His new transmission will be shipped out later today. Thank you Dan.
 

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Discussion Starter #59
Bill called from Palm Coast. His 2002, with only 20k, is burping in 5th.
 

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Discussion Starter #60
Had a call from a Rune owner. I don't get many of those. Many may not know that a Rune is not a GL1800 but a NRX1800 and only made in 2004 and 2005. According to the parts fish, they came in 8 levels. Has any one had one ???
 
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