I bought a 03 wing recently and was hoping for a little help. The bike had terrible handlebar shake at any speed. I replaced the front tire with a bridgestone first and took all the shake out except at forty mile an hour speed.It had a little shake when you held loose on the bars. I put a brand new wheel and tire on it and had it ballanced, thought for sure it would totally remove the shake but i was wrong, still at 40 mph.Does anyone think a slightly warped brake rotor could cause this? Thanks to anyone who can help.
Handlebar shake
WVWING
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I see where you are coming from, but front end wobbel on large bikes can be due to vibratory inputs from anywhere on the bike. The result is pretty much the same regardless the source and there are several sources or combinations that can be our Huckelberry. On your bike(s) it was not the rear wheel/tire, but on many others it has been; and I am not talking about a rear iend wobble, its the decel handle bar wobble. The wobble happends at certain speeds and speed changes due to the natural frequency of the overall frame stiffness VS mass and other such engineering voodoo beyond my meager means. The front end seems to be the outlet for energy becasue it is lighter in comparison and "articulated", that is the path of least resistance. Snug head bearings provide some dampening and loose bearing fitting hear bearings will sone be damaged and impart their own symptoms such as wander and even the wobbles. Wobbles can be very frustrating to trace down. On my VTX we about went nuts and finally gave-up and installed the AllBalls tapered bearings only to find that alone did not do the trick, turned out to be a defective Metzeler Marathon rear tire that thad fairly low milage.
prs
Ya I will be looking into the swing arm also...Did have the front end apart and all re-torqued..Now just waiting for this weather to change a tad...One thing I was thinkin about though was that tires always wear the left side down first..So maybe this is causing the high speed wobble...You can run it up as far as you want going straight but high speed left hand turns are beginning to be no fun.....O well it will give me a project when the weather warms up..As for that 35 to 40 mph wobble I have pretty much just given up trying to stop that...I just don't let go of the bars at that speed or just go faster is the only cure I have found..
My brother has a 07 wing and it runs perfectly straight. Today I took the rear wheel off it and installed on mine. It acted exactly like it did before, 40 mph wobble.I think my next move is to take your advice and at least try to adjust the tube bearings,it makes sense to me. I 'm not sure whats causing this but its not the tires or wheels for sure. I'll keep working on it till I get it fixed hopefully.I'm going to check the swing arm adjustment too. When I bought this bike I knew it had a shake but figured it was just the tires. I do want to thank everyone for thier input on my problem.
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My wing has the 40-35 tank slapping shake and I have put new tires all around. 1000 miles later its back with a vengance. Buddy had same problem, put "all Balls" on, a Race tech fork rebuild and rear shock and shake persists. Honda says "Not our Problem man"
Hate to say it but my choices are "Get used to it" and "Don't take the hands off of the bar".
I speculate for fixes but I'm no expert and after a buddy spent $2K on his suspension and its still there I guess I have to suck it up or sell the bike
I feel your pain
I'm not the Wing expert. I relayed what I'd kept above from earlier motorcycles that had the wobble: three HD touring bikes, Honda ST1300, and three Yamaha FJR's. All developed some decel wobble before the front or rear tires cupped. HD specifically has a test that requires the mechanic to allow the front steering to freely swing starting from full left with the tire elevated. Others require a pull scale fork deflection (as in the link) or similar to test for looseness. All spec a pre-load torque, most followed by a lower running torque.
In the case of the Wing, my 2012 Service Manual (p. 16-47) specs a procedure similar to the above link for preloading the steering bearings. I have an offset torque wrench adapter. Honda specs a special wrench to mate with the adjuster nut. You can make your own by grinding away part of a socket to produce the required ears (two is ok) that fit into the nut.
Tighten adjustment nut to 21 lb-ft.
Loosen and retighten the nut to same torque.
Turn the steering L-R lock to lock at least four times to seat the bearings.
Retighten the nut to the same torque.
Repeat the steering swing L-R several more times.
Then, with the front wheel off the ground and the steering straight ahead, attach a soft strap around one fork between the upper and lower bridges (just above the fork seal for example). Hook a spring scale (fish weighing scale) to the strap and pull 90 deg to an imaginary line running across the bridge (scale pulling along the bike's front to back centerline, as shown above). The fork should start to move/turn between 2-3.1 lb-ft on the pull scale. If higher, loosen the bearing pre-load. If less, tighten it.
If your concerned about the accuracy of the scale, lift a quart of water in a light container (plastic bottled is good) with the scale. Should weigh 2# plus a little bit for the container.
Install the lock washer and nut. Honda says to tighten it 90 deg after finger tight then lock it. The guy above says leave a 0.020 clearance between the lock nut and lock washer and tells why.
Gary
Edit: I missed your brake rotor question. I'd try spinning the front tire and look/listen for any warpage. If warped, the brake pads may drag unevenly. If you have a dial indicator or fixed object (wire attached to the fork with the open end barely touching the rotor), spin it and look for wobble or runout.
I did spin the wheel and one rotor has a little runout, but it is very little.I was wondering if this has caused anyone a wobble issue,
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Rotor run-out would cause a pulse type feed back to the hand brake lever if bad enough. If it is very little, then all it may be doing is making noise. Not a cause for handle bar deceleration wobble...
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While you're investigating this issue, take a look at the forks up at the triple tree... are they both at the same height? Are all the triple tree bolts torqued? Is the axle alignment mark flush on the lower left fork? Is the new tire properly seated all the way around the rim? Is it installed in the correct direction? Are the axle clamp bolts torqued properly?
There is a fair amount of weight in the front wheel assembly. When a force acts on the wheel to move it left or right there is enough flex in the forks and triple tree for that energy to wind itself up to the handle bars. Then that energy oscillates up and down until it dissipates. If you have someone hold the back of the bike down and rapidly move the handle bars back and forth while looking down the tunnel you will be able to see the effect this flex has on the front wheel. When everything is exactly right, even with OEM components, the GL1800 won't wobble unless some outside force acts on the wheel. Types of pavement, a small rock scalloped/cupped tires or some type of debris that forces the tire off center and that energy starts to wind up the forks... could be anything. You may have to have the forks rebuilt.. fresh springs, seals, sliders and bushings, etc. At this point a lot of folks give up, toss in a set of tapered stem bearings to dampen the energy as it starts. Shrug... what ever works...
There is a fair amount of weight in the front wheel assembly. When a force acts on the wheel to move it left or right there is enough flex in the forks and triple tree for that energy to wind itself up to the handle bars. Then that energy oscillates up and down until it dissipates. If you have someone hold the back of the bike down and rapidly move the handle bars back and forth while looking down the tunnel you will be able to see the effect this flex has on the front wheel. When everything is exactly right, even with OEM components, the GL1800 won't wobble unless some outside force acts on the wheel. Types of pavement, a small rock scalloped/cupped tires or some type of debris that forces the tire off center and that energy starts to wind up the forks... could be anything. You may have to have the forks rebuilt.. fresh springs, seals, sliders and bushings, etc. At this point a lot of folks give up, toss in a set of tapered stem bearings to dampen the energy as it starts. Shrug... what ever works...
The fork/axle alignment and fasterner torque suggestions above are good ones. You might also elevate the front wheel, grab the lower forks, and see if there's any fore and aft play in the steering shaft/upper bearing assembly. It should be wobble-free if the bearings are properly seated. That test is a crude one at best, but most of the manufacturers still seem to suggest it.
Make sure the tire's concentric and doesn't wobble fore, aft and sideways when spun.
Best to look it all over. If there's no apparent misalignment of the various parts, making sure the steering shaft bearings are ok, lubed, and properly tightened would be my next step.
If you have the Service Manual lots of this is described in the front wheel/suspension/steering section.
Gary
Edit: I've been going through Fred H.'s excellent DVDs I bought, and the stem bearing adjustment/front wheel/forks/tire change are well covered. Great source of visual info when used along with the service manual.
Make sure the tire's concentric and doesn't wobble fore, aft and sideways when spun.
Best to look it all over. If there's no apparent misalignment of the various parts, making sure the steering shaft bearings are ok, lubed, and properly tightened would be my next step.
If you have the Service Manual lots of this is described in the front wheel/suspension/steering section.
Gary
Edit: I've been going through Fred H.'s excellent DVDs I bought, and the stem bearing adjustment/front wheel/forks/tire change are well covered. Great source of visual info when used along with the service manual.
Thank's everyone for the good advice. I can't seem to track down the cause of my 40mph shake. My next move is to install allballs in the steering stem. I ordered the bearings and when I get time to put them in I will let you know if it cures the problem. Lets hope so.
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Hey Wing, do you have the tools for the swing arm adjustment?
If not I know a guy that might bring them down to you, and if you can get "PRS" to show up too maybe we can have a get together and talk this all out, I feel he's on the right track with his advice.
My swing arm was causing me all kinda of problems until I re-torqued it back to where it belonged. And yeah it started at around 20,000 miles.
People can say all they want about the head bearings being all the problem and new all ball bearings solving the problem, (maybe it did theirs, but now everyone) I've got the very best Traxxion has to offer and it didn't slow my shake down a bit, Through chasing the shake you're describing, I now own four sets of wheels, two sets are brand new; tried three different types of tire/wheel balancing systems and have all kind of tires setting around, one new rear end, one new drive shaft and none of it helped a bit; but now I have a new swing arm with new bearings properly installed and torqued. YES!!! My little girl is new again!!!
Also the alternator drive can cause this shaking as well as the cam timing being off. Not spark timing!
If you need the tools just let me know and I'll bring them down to you. :thumbup:
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Madison WV aka Boone County, I am just down the road from u in good ole McDowell. My new 2010 wing I bought new in March of 2010 wobbled with 0 miles, brand new tires, etc. It is a problem with the bike but I just keep my hands on the bars during decel and no problem. I dont even check for it anymore, just enjoy the ride.
I have an update on the wobble. I tore into the front stem bearings and found the factory bearings was greased good and the torque seemed about right. I went ahead and installed the allballs and torqed them to twenty five pounds. I rode the bike this morning and its unbelievable how much of an improvement it did to the bike. The bike rides great without any shake at ant speed with hands on or off the bars. Does anyone have experience with the allballs loosening up after riding for a while, they seem just a little stiff but I think they might loosen a little. Thank's
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