[Arch Wood]

I do like the better sound and the mesh feature, but I feel like I got ripped off spending 400 dollars on the 60S ...

Well, as some others have, I bought a pair of them...$800.00. IMHO (at this point) money not well spent. Im still holding out hope that Sena figures out a solution and provides an update.

 

[Fred H.]

The root of the problem lies in trying to use a single volume control on the device to control multiple volume settings. It would have probably been smarter to have balance settings in the App for all the separate paired devices and just have the main knob on the unit act as a master volume control. Then you'd just need to go into the app to make tweaks to each paired devices volume setting until you got them where you wanted.

If they were really smart, they would incorporate some sort of "smart volume" setting that would automatically balance the levels of the all the paired devices (dynamically) to be equal, so the user didn't have to try to manage them. A few simple OP amp circuits could easily do this. But there might be cases where someone would want the intercom to be louder (or softer) than the main paired phone, so some trim setting still might be needed.

I guess my point is that there are a lot of better ways Sena could have solved the multiple volume level issue if they simply put a little more thought into it. At the very LEAST, the intercom volume needs to be adjustable without changing the MASTER volume setting.

 

[Fred H.]

So just for grins, I looked at the updated Motorcycle App from Sena, and interestingly enough, I found some new volume settings for both the Mesh and Bluetooth intercom levels in the app. Maybe this is Sena's solution?? One thing I noticed is that the Bluetooth and Mesh volume levels are tied together, so a change to either one affects both of them.

I haven't tested it, but maybe this is a way you can turn down the intercom level so it doesn't blow you out of your helmet.

 

[Roadie]

Not a shill for Sena by any means, but they're number one in the market for a reason....and sometimes, it's not technology.

It's marketing.

That's also the reason where people need to become educated about these types of products, as "the bleeding edge of technology" sometimes isn't a comfortable place to be, as you and others are experiencing.

Which is also a hallmark of Sena (letting the customer iron out all the bugs and weird stuff in the product).

Again, a function of education, and a discussion on these very forums for...geez, twenty years now.

Best of luck to ya!

Yea Im guilty of not researching more of the 60S before I bought it. I just assumed that the 60S would had worked like my 20S Evo with the separate volume controls, plus all the upgrades like the better sound, mesh, waterproofing, better connection,battery life. It just never occurred to me that Sena wouldn't had kept what worked so well on the 20S,50S with the 60S. Sena spent all that effort on the useless LED light show, but should had focus on making the 60S work like it should, anyways lesson learned and I'll never make that mistake again.

 

[Navy Gator]

If the Gold Wing is paired as a "phone", then how does that separate volume work since nearly all the audio (including phone calls) is passed through CarPlay to the headset as "phone"?

And then what is considered as "master volume" since the CarPlay "phone" connection will always be active?

What is needed is a separate volume controls for intercom and GPS paired devices.

It appears Sena doesn't "get it". Every single paired device needs it's own volume control. This includes both Mesh and Bluetooth intercoms.

It isn’t the devices, it is the protocol for different functions regardless of device that lets the headset separate volume controls and prioritize those inputs

phone = hfp
Navigation = hfp
Phone app for navigation = hfp
CB = hfp

intercom = not sure what it is but is different than hfp and A2DP

music = A2DP

that is why it is possible to have multiple inputs from multiple devices with the same protocol active at the same time (wing’s nav talking at the same time as phone navigation app talking).

in non-60S headsets, these would have higher priority and interrupt both intercom and music

In 60s intercom is highest priority
Side note: -another 60S issue is phone call riser talk being put on both the phone call and intercom at the same time

the wing also does protocol and source prioritization before it gets to a headset,
that is why CB will trump anything coming from the Wing ,
the wing knows the HFP input is from the CB and will send CB to the headset and stop sending anything else. The headset will then have to decide what to do with the CB (HFP) input vs intercom input

So, for all headsets, there are two considerations (protocol and volume for that protocol) that are interrelated but different

 

[Roadie]

So just for grins, I looked at the updated Motorcycle App from Sena, and interestingly enough, I found some new volume settings for both the Mesh and Bluetooth intercom levels in the app. Maybe this is Sena's solution?? One thing I noticed is that the Bluetooth and Mesh volume levels are tied together, so a change to either one affects both of them.

I haven't tested it, but maybe this is a way you can turn down the intercom level so it doesn't blow you out of your helmet.

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View attachment 497038

No I played with these settings and all they do is adjust the volume level across the board. The only way to make the 60S useful with talking rider to rider and listening to music is turn the volume down on the 60S and turn the volume all the way up with the Gold Wings audio..then its somewhat OK but a compromise with lower music volume than I like at times. You can also play the music thru the Gold Wings speakers which is ok but not what I like. But when riding alone and just listening to music the 60S is pretty awesome with its sound IMO.

 

[Fred H.]

No I played with these settings and all they do is adjust the volume level across the board. The only way to make the 60S useful with talking rider to rider and listening to music is turn the volume down on the 60S and turn the volume all the way up with the Gold Wings audio..then its somewhat OK but a compromise with lower music volume than I like at times. You can also play the music thru the Gold Wings speakers which is ok but not what I like. But when riding alone and just listening to music the 60S is pretty awesome with its sound IMO.

You're right, I just did some testing with these volume settings, and they are all married to the master volume control, so no matter what you do, you can't set the intercom volumes different than the master.

 

[kwthom]

intercom = not sure what it is but is different than hfp and A2DP

Probably HSP.

HFP is a superset of HSP.

Commonly-used profiles for Bluetooth (e.g. Sena probably uses all of these in one way or another): What Are Bluetooth Profiles?

 

[Navy Gator]

Anyone willing to help me do some testing this Tuesday late afternoon/evening or/and Wednesday while I’m in transit to Zion/Bryce/Capital Reef?

Just need take some short phone calls?

I dont have a definitive schedule for those day, will be a bit adhoc but probably can work out a time if needed

@Fred H. @kwthom @Roadie @Auburn

 

[Johnny Jon]

I installed the new JM cb volume amplifier- works awesome up 3.1 miles in 80 mph wind

 

[Navy Gator]

I installed the new JM cb volume amplifier- works awesome up 3.1 miles in 80 mph wind

Fabulous!

 

[WNG-2]

Very Interesting. Perhaps they will come out with a 70s for who knows how much to fix this? I have two 20s units. My wife doesn't ride anymore so I am essentially just using the headset to run Android Auto and receive phone calls. Over the summer I purchased a Shoei Neotec 3 helmet. I installed my 20S. I was considering buying the integrated Sena unit for the helmet just for a cleaner look, and improved battery life. I understand this unit is based on the 50S. Is that true, and does it have the same volume control flaw? I am leaning towards just running the 20s and carrying the spare 20s on trips and long days(rare) to deal with battery life. Thanks for all the information.

 

[2 wheeler]

I think I'll just keep my Packtalk Bold. Volumes are adjustable for each different application. My only problem is a staple in rear tire and waiting for a new one.

 

[Navy Gator]

I understand this unit is based on the 50S. Is that true, and does it have the same volume control flaw? I am leaning towards just running the 20s and carrying the spare 20s on trips and long days(rare) to deal with battery life. Thanks for all the information.

The SRL-3 which integrates into the Neotech 3 is indeed based on the 50S
Like the 20S, the SRL-3 and 50S have to be dialed in to reduce background noise sensitivity.

Only the 60S has the volume issue and prioritization issue. The SRL 3 and 50S don't.

 

[WNG-2]

The SRL-3 which integrates into the Neotech 3 is indeed based on the 50S
Like the 20S, the SRL-3 and 50S have to be dialed in to reduce background noise sensitivity.

Only the 60S has the volume issue and prioritization issue. The SRL 3 and 50S don't.

Thanks very much!

 

[Candy Red Tour DCT Airbag]

I have a question on the mesh / bluetooth…..I understand the mesh is for bike to bike conversation…is the bluetooth intercom just for rider to passenger talking, or can the bluetooth be used for bike to bike as well ??….thx

Scott

 

[Roadie]

The downside to those built in headsets is they can not be charged on the fly like the 20S Evo, 50S, and the 60S can. Also when you change helmets you have to invest in a new headset instead of using your existing headset with the new helmet. I really like the looks with the Shoei GT Air and the Neotech, but the cons with the built in headsets outweigh the looks IMO.

 

[Navy Gator]

I have a question on the mesh / bluetooth…..I understand the mesh is for bike to bike conversation…is the bluetooth intercom just for rider to passenger talking, or can the bluetooth be used for bike to bike as well ??….thx

Scott

You can use mesh for rider passenger intercom as well as Bluetooth Intercom. Both Sena and Cardo mesh have the option for a private group.

 

[Candy Red Tour DCT Airbag]

You can use mesh for rider passenger intercom as well as Bluetooth Intercom. Both Sena and Cardo mesh have the option for a private group.

ok, but does anyone use the bluetooth intercom for bike to bike ?

 

[Roadie]

ok, but does anyone use the bluetooth intercom for bike to bike ?

Sure, there are riders who still have older headsets with only BT without mesh.
I was very happy to see that you can use mesh and BT at the sametime with the 60S with those times when some riders have mesh and the other rider only has BT.