[Earthdog]

ISG should set a code if it is the source of the problem. If there aren't any codes, then I'd probably guess a bad fuel pump.

I don't think I'd install an ISG from someone elses bike into another customers bike. What happens if the ISG from the other bike gets damaged during the process. I'd be really mad if I brought my bike in for a recall service and found out they pulled parts off it to troubleshoot some other bike. This is just wrong on so many levels.

@Fred H. They say there are no codes and tell me they have confirmed the Fuel Pump is good. If a bad ISG throws a code then that implies it's not the issue. IMHO but I don't understand in general.

 

[Fred H.]

As previously pointed out by others on this thread, it could be something as simple as a bad start switch. I'd probably also remove those two fuses I mentioned earlier and inspect the fuse holder contacts for corrosion or heat damage.

Smart mechanics always check the SIMPLE stuff FIRST before replacing expensive and labor intensive parts.

 

[BrokenBackJack]

Have you checked your grounds and battery connections.
These things do weird things when grounds start to fail.

 

[remoandiris]

Smart mechanics always check the SIMPLE stuff FIRST before replacing expensive and labor intensive parts.

This is likely part of the problem. It seems these days dealership "mechanics" are more into "swaptronics" than actual detective work. If the computer can't tell them the problem and fix, they just start guessing.

 

[mrjava]

If you're already checking the grounds and connections, you might as well take the time to clean those connections.
Just a thought..

 

[grayelky]

Correction 3 days and I had put 200 miles on it. I have owned 2 other wings and this one was in great shape.

I am only the messenger on what the dealer said. I thought it was crazy myself. I went down a few hours ago to talk directly to the mechanic instead of the service writer and he clearly said Honda directed him too. I am shocked there is not a testing method outside the chassis. Unfortunately I am not aware of a good trustworthy dealer in Metro Atlanta. I or my buddies have had poor experiences with them all.

Have you/friends tried the Honda dealer on river stone pkwy in Canton (maybe 2 miles west of I-575)? PM me for an address and phone number if you need it.

 

[Too Hot]

The previous owner of my bike had to have the ISG replaced when it was relatively new. There have been no problems with it since and has over 51000 miles on it now. BTW, I had both bolts replaced during the primary bolt recall.

 

[WNG-2]

Deleted.

 

[WNG-2]

This is likely part of the problem. It seems these days dealership "mechanics" are more into "swaptronics" than actual detective work. If the computer can't tell them the problem and fix, they just start guessing.

Yup. Exactly. They start firing parts at the problem with their parts cannon vs. old fashioned diagnosis. The problem is that the expensive ammunition comes at the owner's expense, and the problem is not solved.

 

[gkarasik]

Yup. Exactly. They start firing parts at the problem with their parts cannon vs. old fashioned diagnosis. The problem is that the expensive ammunition comes at the owner's expense, and the problem is not solved.

I don't disagree, but in the case of the ISG, there is no diagnostic port.

 

[WNG-2]

I don't disagree, but in the case of the ISG, there is no diagnostic port.

Indeed, however it is too expensive of a part to arbitrarily throw at the problem without solid diagnostic proof. Or, so it seems to me...

 

[murf]

Indeed, however it is too expensive of a part to arbitrarily throw at the problem without solid diagnostic proof. Or, so it seems to me...

There are six DTC codes that indicate a problem with the ISG.

1. DTC 116-1, ISG Malfunction
2. DTC 116-2, ISG Malfunction, brush
3. DTC 116-3, ISG Malfunction, primary
4. DTC 116-4, ISG Malfunction, drive train
5. DTC 116-5, ISG Malfunction, inhibitor line
6. DTC 116-6, ISG Malfunction, exciting output line.

Easiest to diagnose are brush problems and drive train problems. The only serviceable item on the ISG itself are the brushes which can be replaced. If DTC 116-5 is displayed, you replace the ECM with a known good one.

Definitely agree it is too expensive of a part to just throw at the problem without a good solid diagnosis. Too bad the “solid diagnosis” involves replacing the ISG with a known good one to see if the problem goes away. Dealers certainly do not have a “spare” ISG lying around to “replace the ISG with a known good one” to resolve issues, and they don’t have spare ECM’s lying around if DTC 116-5 is indicated.

 

[gkarasik]

Indeed, however it is too expensive of a part to arbitrarily throw at the problem without solid diagnostic proof. Or, so it seems to me...

What's the alternative?

 

[WNG-2]

What's the alternative?

Perhaps there is none, providing that due diligence has been done to rule out anything else that might be the problem.

 

[gkarasik]

Perhaps there is none, providing that due diligence has been done to rule out anything else that might be the problem.

I think the problem is that Honda is using a part that can't be examined for faults.

 

[murf]

I think the problem is that Honda is using a part that can't be examined for faults.

About the only thing that can be examined is if there is a problem with the brushes or the drive train. Brushes can be replaced. Same thing applies to the two ISG bolts.

 

[Zee Fifty]

What's the alternative?

The best way to verify the root cause of the issue is not to buy another one and hope for the best. The best way is to reproduce the known failure mode in a known good motorcycle using the suspect ISG…. They should remove your ISG and install it in a known good motorcycle. Then if they reproduce the failure I would then proceed to buy a replacement.

If you were to buy a new ISG and install it and It works you really don’t know if you just had a loose or bad connection that was rectified by replacing it. You could be left with 2 good ISGs .

 

[gkarasik]

The best way to verify the root cause of the issue is not to buy another one and hope for the best. The best way is to reproduce the known failure mode in a known good motorcycle using the suspect ISG…. They should remove your ISG and install it in a known good motorcycle. Then if they reproduce the failure I would then proceed to buy a replacement.

If you were to buy a new ISG and install it and It works you really don’t know if you just had a loose or bad connection that was rectified by replacing it. You could be left with 2 good ISGs .

You'd have to have a known good motorcycle, and it's not an easy swap. A new bike would have to be taken off the sales floor. They could use a used bike, if they had one, I suppose.

 

[gravnov]

There is a guy here in the German Goldwing forum, who experienced a bad ISG and got this successfully repaired by his dealer.
His bike showed the symptom, which @gkarasik reported in post #14.

...There was only one symptom: The bike would not start or even turn over...

The dealer said: "...The coal holder was jammed..."

I asked the owner which code the dealer pulled but I haven't received an answer until now.

 

[murf]

There is a guy here in the German Goldwing forum, who experienced a bad ISG and got this successfully repaired by his dealer.
His bike showed the symptom, which @gkarasik reported in post #14.



The dealer said: "...The coal holder was jammed..."

I asked the owner which code the dealer pulled but I haven't received an answer until now.

“Coal holder was jammed.” Does that mean the the mechanism for keeping the brushes in place was jammed?